The new dlc

[JABBERJAW]

Facts:

1) we were told hardcore fans will not be disappointed
2) WOHD fury is downloadable ( no racebox though for sp)
3) all campaigns in single player are playable.
4). All options for multiplayer are available ( I think), but they look a little different
5) load times fr had on vita are only slightly slower ( this is no problem)
6) in multi player, the game runs from 20-25 fps, it is hard to play unless you have not played HD on ps3. It is playable though, but the bad framerate makes no sense as 2048s graphics seem better, and larger as well.
7) 5 months now of asking for racebox/ custom controls/ single player time trials. THESE ARE NOT IN. They have said not one thing regarding them besides " please send suggestions via pm."

8: this is not new content and is extremely disappointing. It's a fine addition, however how much time was wasted on this when these other issues could have been addressed and solved in the last 5 months.


While being upset with this content, SL had do do this per Sony. Hopefully they will optimize 2048 now, and add what the game desperately needs for us to really enjoy it. While it is highly unlikely to be done before the NA tournament, it would be great to play this head to head with 12 wo fanatics in the same room.

[leungbok]

Off course there's no racebox on the new dlc wohd/fury !! People would compare and says "WTF, why do that feature isn't available for 2048's part of the game ???"

[infoxicated]

Al, you'll remember a few years back when you made an insulting and scathing attack on the game developers over things that didn't meet your expectations with a previous iteration of the game?

Well you have every right to complain, but this time around don't make it personal.

I would also have thought that by this time you'd know that the development team aren't the ones solely responsible for the direction of a title. It's not their game - it' Sony's game.

Now, do you think that Sony are going to fund development cost for a new version of the same game to be released within six months of it coming out when the Vita is starved of new content?

Or do you maybe think they focussed on getting more content onto the platform?

Unless there's some wonderfully contrived deadline for when you have to play a version of WipEout created specifically to meet your needs, I suggest you start looking at the bigger picture.

Was WipEout 2048 a bit of a rush job in order to make a hardware launch?

Most probably it was.

Are the development team entirely at fault over this and are they deliberately attempting to mislead the fan base?

Most definitely not.

[leungbok]

Rob, the fact that Sony probably put pressure on SL for the release of wipeout is one thing (it was exactly what i said when most people started to yell at SL, months ago). But i don't think they told the studio : "hey, rip off that horrendous racebox feature. Casual gamers, our main target hates that sort of stuff !!"
There's definitively a very very very veeeeryyyyyyyy bad dev's decision on 2048'S development !!!

[JABBERJAW]

Rob, there are many things wrong with the game that don't meet my specifications of a great old school wipeout game. However I have said none of those, I love how the game plays, and where it is in terms of overall gameplay. Whoever is making the decision to not put it in now is at fault, as well as whoever took it out in the first place. Getting led on is not acceptable, maybe there is hope, but there is no answer, 5 months! 5 months Rob of not getting any answer of any sort for the most basic fundemental part of the game. THIS IS NOT JUST ME, not by a long shot. I am not holding ami responsible ( if thats what you think) she is doing her job.

It comes down to, great playing game, cannot play eachother in a reasonable manner, ask for fix to play great playing game for 5 months, no response of any sort, put out rehashed game instead.

Those are the facts of what has happened, it's awful. Would it be better to say one thng then forget about it, then Sony can forget as well

Pointing out that it was a huge mistake, and continues to be, is not an insult, it is actually what is happening.

[kaori]

A full game (Jeu Complet) without its racebox. (http://i46.servimg.com/u/f46/12/06/70/68/dsc_0811.jpg)

[MarcoM]

damn I thought I was overlooking racebox. But it is just not in. Still I like the fact that I can play it for free on the Vita now.

[Boycey83]

I hate it when people are overly negative about these things.

But here I go anyway... The framerate is really bad :(

On the other hand, 16 free courses & it looks very pretty.

Edit: The UI is the worst interface I have ever seen. Once you've got a medal for an event, you can no longer see what type of event it is (and even when you can see what type of event it is, you don't know the course/speed class until you click on it).

Get ready to memorise the location of all your favourite courses' zone and speed lap events... I hate that it sounds like we are all a bunch of whingers, but come on!

[trk_rkd]

I hate it when people are overly negative about these things.

But here I go anyway... The framerate is really bad :(

Yeah. I too hate to be overly negative (and I completely agree worth infoxi's comments about the dev's probably being constrained by the budget afforded them by sony etc.) but I must say I'm a bit disappointed with this. It's free, which is fantastic, but we've known that it was gonna be free for a while. Moreover, I frankly don't think anybody would be terribly happy if they paid for it. I've seen it drop frames in speed lap, for god's sake, and the tracks generally look worse than 2048's tracks. I never really minded the cut from 60 to 30 fps for 2048 (I thought it was acceptable for a handheld), and didn't really even mind that much about the occasional choppiness in combat mode. But the HD tracks just push the frame rate compromise too far. I worry that the next "big" console wipeout will be at 30 fps, which would be a HUGE shame.

And yes, the continued absence of racebox is mindboggling. I would've much preferred they address the fundamentals (racebox, custom controls etc) and just gave us four or so new dl tracks, as opposed to this mass of recycled, unoptimised tracks from HD (which were in turn recycled from pure and pulse...)

Oh well. The price is certainly right, at least. Wipeout 2048 is just such a frustrating beast though; it could have be more-or-less as fantastic as previous iterations of wipeout (i.e. the core racing isn't some FUBAR monstrosity like Fusion). But it's so brutally let down by various omissions - and the braindead inclusions of "multiplayer campaign" - that it feels like a missed opportunity at best, and a downright mess at worse. Unfortunately these sub-par HD ports don't do much to remedy my opinion.

[Hacker X]

I'm sorry, but you guys complain too much. Had to say it. Its one thing if you are upset about no racebox. That is highly understandable, but to complain about a free download (if you already purchased the PS3 version) is another thing. Yeah, it has its flaws, but its not THAT bad either. It has a lower framerate, but it doesn't kill the game or make it unplayable or anything. Not to mention there seem to be some new visual affects scattered here and there which ad some grittyness to the HD and Fury's look.

Personally, besides the racebox issue, which I'm highly in agreement on, I am more than ecstatic about the HD/FURY addon! Not only did they come earlier than I expected, but they intergrate very well into 2048. If SL ever ads the racebox then that will make this the definitive Wipeout.

If you are upset about a games design that is one thing, but when you knock it at every turn cause there are things you didn't like, then maybe you should try a different series or something. I have no idea what is up with the lack of racebox updates, or news, but I am a Wipeout fan. Have been since 96' when the original Wipeout came out. We are lucky that Wipeout still exists, as it is a long-running series that has had many opportunities to be discontinued and yet it is still here.

To SL I say honestly, please add the racebox. This is much needed in this game, as I think this is your best work yet. However, I also say JOB WELL DONE keeping Wipeout alive and well. Besides Wipeout Fusion, I'm still proud of the series as my favorite game series of all time, and aside from Sony's hard financial times, and weird dev decisions, I hope you guys keep the Wipeouts coming. I freaking love this game!

[JABBERJAW]

I'm not complaining about hd, only that they put a diorite of that over racebox and custom controls, my Only real complaint of the game, though it is significant. The stuff I wrote about hd is just how it plays

[Flashmops]

I agree with Boycey83, the fact that you can't see the event type after winning a medal baffled me and is a downright stupid design decision (this would of course not be a problem if there was a *drumroll!* RACEBAWCKS!). I didn't own Wipeout HD at first and played it for the first time on the Vita and I was also really confused what race type all the symbols are supposed to stand for. And guess what, if you click on a event, it doesn't even give you a written name of the race type - so my first few races were like "oh so I accidently started a detonator event, I didn't expect that!".

Another thing that is kind of a letdown are the trophies, you automatically get them by finishing the campaigns. Why didn't they just include the trophies from the PS3 version? Are they too hard because of the 30fps?

About the framerate: Before the DLC came out I thought the framerate issues in crossplay were caused by the online-play, because the online-campaign of 2048 also runs at choppier framerates than singleplayer. The first singleplayer race I played today in HD (speedlap in Vineta K) had the same issues, but now - somewhat magically - the framerate remains at a steady 30fps in all HD/Fury races and on all tracks. It felt like the game had to warmup or something, but it's really playable enough for me now.

Even though it sounds like I am disappointed with this DLC, the fun I am having with it outweighs the negative aspects, so I am pretty happy with it right now. Racebox HAS to come, though, and DLC for the 2048 part of the game, too.

[kaori]

I'm sorry, but you guys complain too much. Had to say it. Its one thing if you are upset about no racebox. That is highly understandable, but to complain about a free download (if you already purchased the PS3 version) is another thing....

NObody is upset about these free download (or not for players with Blu-Ray or an other PSN account).
The reason is this buzz since April, "announcements very soon", "a BIG thing at the corner"... We knew that since February 16th, HD and Fury pack for these spring (link (http://blog.us.playstation.com/2012/02/16/3-great-reasons-to-try-ps-vitaps3-cross-play-content/)). There always has no NEW announcement for 8 weeks.
It's the reason of the anger. Tell us "announcements very soon" over and just announce a thing we know since February 16th !!!

When they announce a thing, they don't realize it... Spurious times should be deleted since April (link (http://community.eu.playstation.com/t5/WipEout/WipEout-2048-1-02-and-WipEout-HD-Fury-2-50-Patches-Available/td-p/15737351)). Loss of online progression were never corrected.

[Dogg Thang]

My frame rate doesn't seem to be warming up at all - definitely well below 30fps and makes the main 2048 look silky smooth by comparison. But also, are my eyes broken (entirely possible) or is this much murkier than the 2048 game? It's like the res has dropped too - look at the edges of the tracks or the countdown board for example. And yet sometimes it seems crisp. It couldn't possibly be dynamically changing the res? That sounds unlikely. But playing some HD and Fury tracks and then going to 2048, well it's like putting on glasses.

Visuals aside (though the frame rate is a pretty big thing to put aside), these are some of the best tracks from Pure and Pulse and it's nice to have them on a handheld. Not a massive HD/Fury fan but it does now make for a fairly impressive package.

[mangaroo]

Finally got to pick it up. Framerate is playable in time trial/speed lap so far, haven't played many races. Would still like 10-20% more to be comfortable. Searching all over the grids for a decent event is retarded though - causing quite a bit of frustration. Nice to see the tracks available for the Vita though.

Edit: Some of these faster races are not really worth playing with the lag [edit: actually it's not that bad]. The time trials are still really good fun but still needs proper selection and to speed up a little for regular decent standards.

I've been mixing various grids and haven't completed one of the collections yet - do you unlock the speed lap races for easy access like in 2048?

[JABBERJAW]

Here was a reply I got to a question on Facebook, this is where the big agitation is coming from

My question on messages:

Is anyone checking this anymore? It seemed good for a while, but it seems no one is checking anything, or posting anything. It's been almost two months since " new content coming soon was said". That isn't soon, we would at least like an update/ explanation like maybe, "hey we added stuff to our update, so it is taking longer". Players are losing interest now, which is bad, especially when it seems like the game is about to get better. On a side note, I hope my last Adhoc suggestion ( simple fix) is implemented. It is 100% unplayable right now, but it could easily be the best addition as it would have no lag compared to online

SundayWipEout 2048

We'd love to give you details for DLC but unfortunately our hands are tied with regard to what we post and when we post details. You will see a post here, PlayStation Blogs and Twitter with an announcement as soon as we can.
We understand you're feeling frustrated and we are absolutely dying to tell you, but we can't, not yet

We can asssure you, you wont be waiting much longer at all and that it will be worth it.

Cheers Al

SundayAl

Thanks!

" it will be worth it". That was the kicker, they know for sure that most of us were wanting racebox and controls, and hoping it was in, based on other comments, we had a right to hope on this one. It's amazing many people on these threads post this exact stuff, how did they think it would be " worth the wait" for us?

Probably getting told to write that I guess, I'd rather get no reply than getting my hopes up though.

[daybrain]

wipeout is all about speed. i think the "core" developers will first try to speedup the framerate. it's like the first ps3>vita portation. it's a learning project which influences many future vita/ps3/4 developments.
later staff resources will be available for a simple racebox implementation.

[JABBERJAW]

There's no evidence we are getting it at all. The framerate for the game I bought (2048) is fine, optimize after adding necessities. It would be nice if HD ran better, but we already have that on ps3. It's weird that the framerate is low though, and the graphics are juiced up either. Quick port do you think?

[G'Kyl]

Not a quick port, I assume, but certainly no full-blown conversion either.

I'm intrigued, actually, because I have to admit I never fully appreciated 60 fps... until it wasn't 60 fps no more. ;) It's quite interesting to have a direct comparison between two completely different framerates in one game (if you will). I had to make somewhat slight yet significant adjustments to my reaction time and to the kind of inputs I make - it's much more of a "knowing what lies ahead" than "react to what's happening". Anyway, one thing I'm missing is difficulty settings. Am I overlooking something? Right now the campaign is quite honestly a somewhat boring rush through the events.

Also, Racebox and Custom Controls - but I believe everything had been and is being said there as it is.

[chalovak]

For me it's pretty logical that this DLC was released first, not the one with possible racebox. If we get RB as the next expansion, the track selection will contain all the tracks available now (2048+HD+Fury), not only 2048's. How cool is that!?

[daybrain]

what i say is that wipeout hd was like a classic ps3 reference development for a 7 core architecture. vita has completely new hardware which is not in the same way a sony special arrangement as previous sony consoles. vita developments work different now when all the knowledge is here for ps3. so wipeout is a kind of an example for a ps3>vita portation. an example on which a lot developers from all the different game companies will profit. and i'm absolutely sure that SL does some pioneer works here and i'm sure they are mostly occupied with questions about how fast the (ps3) game(s) can run. (sorry for poor english)

but why are there no music tracks in the dlc? license probs??

[G'Kyl]

Doesn't have to be problems. Why pay for another set of licenses if you already have a good, if different soundtrack? 2048 is a different game - HD and Fury are just DLC in this case..

[Temet]

The most incredible thing in this story and why I'm really pissed off, it's not because I don't get what I want/would like... but just because there is no communication.
I would prefer 10 thousand times to read on Wipeout 2048 facebook page : "Racebox will never be implemented, deal with it".
This would be fine for me. I'd say : "Ok, 2048 is definitely over for me".
You know, it's like when you're in a train that stops between 2 stations and all you got is : "We are stopped". Yeah thanks, but why?
What makes people angry is mainly to have no explanation and no news.

So, Ami, if you read this (I don't have facebook account and will never create one), just communicate!
I'm pretty sure you'll see a lot of messages of disappointment, but it will be the last wave.
Now, each announce is a followed by a wave a disappointement.

[MarcoM]

For me it's pretty logical that this DLC was released first, not the one with possible racebox. If we get RB as the next expansion, the track selection will contain all the tracks available now (2048+HD+Fury), not only 2048's. How cool is that!?

One can always dream. But I think this was the last update.

[chalovak]

One can always dream. But I think this was the last update.

What about unnecessary AR museum?

[MarcoM]

Compared to Racebox I think AR (any type of it in any game) is heavily overrated. AR is technology because it is possible to make, not because users want it.

RACEBOX NOW!

/frustrated

[Boycey83]

You're right that I didn't pay for this DLC, but if I did I would not be happy, the framerate is just on the wrong side of acceptable for me I'm afraid.

I'm not one of the people who was upset about the drop to 30fps for 2048 either. For me that's perfectly playable, but the HD/Fury content is much much worse than that, even in Zone / Speed Lap where there is nothing going on.

As for "maybe you should try a different series or something"... lol no :)

[infoxicated]

Probably getting told to write that I guess...
She's probably being told exactly what she can write, and being told what she definitely can't write. Same as I was when I worked at Studio Liverpool.

Nobody wants to upset their producer. Nobody wants to upset the marketing team in London.

Yes, sometimes it's free and easy.

Sometimes the producer will say "We gave Eurogamer the Pulse teaser video and they still don't have it up on their site this morning - stick it on WipEoutZone, Rob!"

And I did. Other times I knew the news weeks in advance of any media outlet. And I wasn't allowed to post the news until it had been on every single gaming website out there.

In fact, sometimes you'll get spoken to like you've sold the company secrets because you posted a picture that you didn't know had been given to another entity as an exclusive image. Which is what happened to me for posting a picture of Pascale Rouser from WipEout Fusion on the main site. I'd been given the picture, told I could use it, then ripped a new one because marketing in London had also given that picture to a German games mag as an exclusive cover.

So it's better to be cautious than in trouble. Would anyone really risk their job over a trivial subject like a video game, just because the fans of said game are DEMANDING AN ANSWER?

No chance. It's better not to communicate than to have those frustrated fans over reacting at a throw-away comment and ending up with it as front page news on Eurogamer "FANS REACT ANGRILY IN SONY FAIL SHOCKER SENSATION!".

Which is why game developers rarely post on fan forums. Because of reactions like yours, Al, and reactions like Temet's, who swore in a sentence directed at Ami.

We did have a good bunch of developers posting on here, once upon a time. Guys like Linky, Colin, and Nick Burcombe.

Do these guys want to suffer personal attacks at the hands of anonymous internet warriors? Do they want to be the one whose throw-away comment is taken out of context in an article that brings their employer into disrepute?

No they don't. It's safer to not communicate at all. And seeing the angry rants posted on the Facebook group and on here, I can't blame them one bit.

Does anyone want to run a gaming website? Because I'm sick of being a child minder.

[MarcoM]

Although I agree completely with you against the cursing, I also notice that SL / Sony does not seem to see the relevance of the things wrong in 2048. Somebody has got to tell them. It seems so simple to give us a racebox and custom controlls.

I just really hope it will happen someday. I have put my 2048 with with the HD/fury content aside. Back to other games. Is that what a developer wants. I know they are in it for the money making (good thing). But guess where my money is going next time.

[Temet]

I asked "Ami" to communicate because, unfortunately for her, she as been chosen for SL communication.
And when I asked her, of course I understand she cannot decide this by herself, but she can transmit the request. It was a not a personal request, but a request to SL of course.
About the "F" word (which I censored myself...), maybe being a French guy watching to American tv shows where the word is said 10 times per sentence made me think it was not so bad. Sorry for that then...

And finally, my reaction was more constructive than you may think! I pointed out that people are angry about communication. It's not knowing that brings the angriness.
I'm not mad that SL released HD to PSVita, even if I can't get it free (I have the BR).
But the big thing should have been season 2051.
I thought before that bringing racebox online could be a hard thing because it would change the online infrastructure. But they did it for the DLC!! So I was apparently wrong.
I'd personaly pay 50$ for this season and fixed online, no problem... but of course this is not a realistic price for non fans...

[Hacker X]

She's probably being told exactly what she can write, and being told what she definitely can't write. Same as I was when I worked at Studio Liverpool.

Nobody wants to upset their producer. Nobody wants to upset the marketing team in London.



This is what gamers on the videogame forums have to sometimes take into consideration. I am a QA Tester for a game that is being worked on. Everyone at the company has to sign NDA's when they are hired. If you say anything or leak any information that is against the NDA's policy, you are putting yourself into a bad situation of getting fired and/or sued by the company.

Its crazy when you watch forums of people talking about a game that you are working on, and you know what is going on at the company or whatever, but can't say anything on the boards, or give info about what the gamers are asking for because you are under contract. It is also frustrating when you are working on a game, and gamers constantly flame the company and the employees with wrong information, or because they do not respond.

The companies themselves have to answer to board of directors, or in SL's case, the parent company Sony, so if Sony is giving rules to SL that are not to be broken, then SL's hands are tied as well. There is a chain of command that has to be acknowledged as game companies are still businesses that are trying to make money, so they have to do what those who are funding them tell them to do.

Its not always as cut and dry as people think it is to just answer their questions when they demand answers.

[mangaroo]

You're right that I didn't pay for this DLC, but if I did I would not be happy, the framerate is just on the wrong side of acceptable for me I'm afraid.

I'm not one of the people who was upset about the drop to 30fps for 2048 either. For me that's perfectly playable, but the HD/Fury content is much much worse than that, even in Zone / Speed Lap where there is nothing going on.

As for "maybe you should try a different series or something"... lol no :)

I felt this way as well at the start but if you keep playing you do get used to it. It is funny, I asked around yesterday before it was released in the UK and a lot of people on reddit were like yeah perfectly smooth, no differences ;0). I know they just released it yesterday and it was a huge load of content but I am super sensitive to framerate issues on the vita after modnation road trip and its devs. One of whom actually went onto reddit and was like "what frame rate problems" in a thread about being disappointed with the game.

I don't agree with the swearing or demands for instant answers but I am very happy with the renewed pressure of requests to get something formal out of SL about it. I don't expect any informal answers and fully understand that it's not possible to give simple answers sometimes but SL is giving a clear impression that they are not prioritising racebox and so they shouldn't really be expecting anything less than the requests. Move onto a different game? More like just hang back.

[Hellfire_WZ]

Right, I am getting sick of this

This game was supposed to be the showcase for CrossPlay so it was always going to take priority in the first DLC, and I'm willing to bet it has been in development for a long time. As in, before the game was released. The studio are answerable to SCEE, and ultimately it is them that take priority, not us. And because of this, as has been mentioned earlier, it is likely to be the case that any comunication by SL is strictly controlled by SCEE. And that includes saying "no" to things. It doesn't matter how loud you shout or much you think we're all entitled to, that is the cold hard truth of the matter. For reasons, see Hacker X's excellent post above this.

Now that this DLC is complete I suspect they will move on to focussing on enhancing the core game and take our suggestions into consideration. Also, Ami was made community manager barely six weeks ago, only then were all our suggestions properly collated and fed to the studio. There is no way that anything could be done with any of them in that period of time, especially not while they were prioritising getting the CrossPlay content finished. Studio Liverpool is not massive, things do take time and they can't do a load of things at once.

But (and this is a message to everybody), regardless of how you feel about the state the game was released in, what features should have been in there, what should be done about it, the lack of communication... there are ways to go about expressing yourselves. Some of the comments I have read have been utterly shameful. As Rob said, it is for that reason that developers no longer post here. And if it continues it would not surprise me if they shut themselves off from this community for good.

So for the last time. Constructive criticism of the content is welcome, but start conducting yourselves in a manner befitting this site. I do not expect to say any more about this.

[Boycey83]

Argh. I can't even get an elite on the first race on Anulpha Pass!!

First and third attempts I got pipped at the post, because 2nd place has a turbo (I couldn't believe it when this happened a second time), the second attempt I used a Turbo in a stupid spot while in first and shot myself off into the scenery, and on my fourth attempt I got a plasma up the jacksy when in first place on the shortcut on the last lap.

Damn you Wipeout HD!

Edit: 5th time lucky! It needs to be said, although there are framerate issues, the game looks stunning once your eyes adjust to everything looking a wee bit different.

[Darkdrium777]

While we should all conduct ourselves to a higher standard and offer constructive criticism (Mind you, as we have done for the past months), there exists a multitude, dare I say an infinity of community forums centered around games made by a development team that uses these forums to communicate with these users. On these forums, you will often find the most intelligent posts you can read, but definitely find the most vapid and stupid posts ever. While posts like these exist, the developers there insist on using the forums to communicate with the users, and do so often for many years. They make abstraction of the trolls/flamers/idiots and continue to use the forums because it is a direct line of access to the community that should not be shunned.
I'm sorry but I believe Studio Liverpool should have a thicker skin if they can't endure a few ****s here or there, if it is truly the reason why they are not posting here anymore. First off, the people here are far more reasonable than on the multitude of forums aforementioned, the ****s being let out only because it's been really that long without concrete information about that certain feature which everyone wants to see. I think if communication was improved, there would be much less frustration around us.

Because, lets face it. This forum is not the Blizzard forums.

[infoxicated]

So Studio Liverpool is a faceless corporate entity that should "grow a thicker skin."

Except for the fact that it's filled with real people who take pride in their jobs, but don't always get to do the things that would appease the fans because of influences outside of their control.

So why can it not be that people learn to control their outbursts instead?

It's nothing to do with having a thick skin, it's case of Sony, the corporate master of the studio, controlling the release of information and dictating what the development budget gets spent on.

Rather than face a public backlash at every misconstrued comment, Sony would quite happily instruct every single developer to have zero interaction with fan communities, meaning nothing would be released unless it came out of the corporate PR machine. That could easily happen if it's deemed more hassle than it's worth. I know first hand how hard Ami works to interact with the community and we're lucky to have someone like her, but that could easily change if Sony decide it's not worth it.

In the past we've had the privilege of Linky explaining why & how he came up with the physics for the anti-gravity system, and Colin Berry explaining why certain tracks were designed the way they were.

There's no corporate remit that tells them to interact with the fan communities. They're doing it on their own personal time (heck, Colin got embroiled in a Barrel Roll debate during the Xmas break in 2007) and, for the most part, Sony turns a blind eye to it.

But when the developers are sent rant filled PM's and are subjected to a confrontational tone, why should they bother to respond?

If you guys really see yourself as a dedicated fan community, then you'll realise that we're in this together - fans, developers, and community support people like Ami.

There's frustration on all sides, no doubt, but suggesting folk should grow a thicker skin just to excuse an insulting or confrontational tone is just way below the standards I'd like to see here.

I'm embarrassed that I provide a vehicle for some of you to behave the way you do.

[leungbok]

I get all your arguments Rob, and i share them in a way. Creating something is not that fun when the ideas you put on your creations aren't understood by your target the way you'd liked to. We are fans, that's true, and fans should support their leasure's providers. But we also are customers, and for that reasons, we definitively deserve some explanations or informations when we purchase a product. When i buy a wipeout product, i expect to have the basic gameplay and options i always saw on the serie. If something lacks (racebox as an example) i would have been informed before purchasing. So probably the blame isn't for SL, but SCEE, anyway the way game industry treat their customers become more and more disgusting (i even heard of a smartphone's game only available whith a connection that simply was unplayable when the servers shut down months ago !! And off course customers didn't knew that until it happens !).

[Colonel]

Well said Rob :+

[Hacker X]

But we also are customers, and for that reasons, we definitively deserve some explanations or informations when we purchase a product. When i buy a wipeout product, i expect to have the basic gameplay and options i always saw on the serie. If something lacks (racebox as an example) i would have been informed before purchasing.


But see lets look at the facts of the financial side of Wipeout games from "Pure" to "HD/Fury Vita DLC". This is where I have an issue with constant negativity towards this game from the fans.

1. Wipeout Pure - $39.99 USD
2. Wipeout Pure - DLC tracks and music packs - $5.00 each
2. Wipeout Pulse - $39.99ish USD
3. Wipeout Pulse DLC tracks - $5ish each (don't remember the exact numbers)
4. Wipeout HD - $20 at launch!
5. Wipeout FURY $10 at launch!
6. Wipeout 2048 $35.99 - $40 depending on digital or physical copy
7. Wipeout HD/FURY DLC - FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE

Now lets look at the reality of Wipeout sales.....

8. Can't say that I really know the exact numbers, but I'm sure this game is not a record breaker

Now lets look at what we continue to see as fans of this game.....

9. NEW CONTENT which is usually either FREE or CHEAP


Now out of all of these iterations of Wipeout, if you are still playing these games today for the prices you paid for them, then I think you have gotten more than your money's worth. The company could charge more for DLC but they really haven't done that. Prime example is the HD FURY add-on for only $10 which doubled HD's replay value.

Yet there are a lot of fans who continue to act like they are entitled to more, more, more like SL owes them something. This is why I said I am grateful that the game is even still around, cause it truthfully isn't a cash cow yet still gets incredible new content.

[kaori]

DLC for WipEout Pure were and are free ;). (And 15€96 for 4 DLC of Pulse)
The DLC for the last 3 games were great, it's why we can hope a quality DLC for 2048. A real DLC for 2048, with new tracks, maybe a season 2051 on tracks around the world (Nova State City won't host AGRC after 2050, read on billboards). And other surprises ;)

However, it seems this cross play DLC have permitted to sell some WipEout 2048 copies, I met lot of newcomers online yesterday. It's a good thing.

[Blaey]

Wipeout Pure - DLC tracks and music packs - $5.00 each

wasnt the dlc for pure all free? I seem to remember there being a ridiculous amount of free extra content (this was before the playstation store) so how would they make you pay for any of it?

I couldn't agree more with you! Studio Liverpool have crafted a beautiful amount of content for little to nothing over the past 20 or so years and if anything we owe them :)

[Hacker X]

Man, its been so long since we got the DLC for PURE that I forgot it was free. I stand corrected. I still can't believe how much extra stuff they had for it. They even released music from WO1 for it like "Messij" which to this day is still my favorite WO soundtrack song. Hopefully we will get DLC for 2048 like that as it does have the potential to expand more on what it is now. Good times.

[newtype]

http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=wipeout+2048

2048 hasn't been selling well by any stretch.

[Darkdrium777]

So Studio Liverpool is a faceless corporate entity that should "grow a thicker skin."I said that it was a faceless corporate entity somewhere? No, you're just making this up.
But yes, if the people who work at Studio Liverpool stopped reading/posting here because of a few idiots, as I've gathered from Hellfire's comment, they should indeed get a thicker skin. Ignoring the assholes is what I suggested, and what everyone else in the industry pretty much does when they have community forums set up. It is not that difficult to gloss over some stupid person's inflammatory comments and hit the block button if you really have to.
This is my opinion, based on what I've seen done pretty much everywhere else. Don't paint me as one of those assholes because you disagree with me on what SL's folks should do to improve communications between them and the community. I'm not insulting them or anything, I just want them to start posting here again like they used to (because I miss it greatly) and suggesting something that's in the realm of possibilities if a few idiots really bother them that much.


So why can it not be that people learn to control their outbursts instead?I didn't say people should post everything either. This isn't the Blizzard forums, but I don't want it to get even close to it either. I appreciate that most people here are reasonable and I encourage people to continue to be.


It's nothing to do with having a thick skin, it's case of Sony, the corporate master of the studio, controlling the release of information and dictating what the development budget gets spent on.Well if Sony is a big asshole this will be a one way only corridor. I'm fairly certain that's not the case, and SL can send some feedback to Sony about the communication issue. If they can do that, that would be great.


But when the developers are sent rant filled PM's and are subjected to a confrontational tone, why should they bother to respond?Umm, they don't, they block the stupid and report it to you or Hellfire? It's what I would do. I won't stop using online forums because one idiot sent me a hate filled PM.


There's frustration on all sides, no doubt, but suggesting folk should grow a thicker skin just to excuse an insulting or confrontational tone is just way below the standards I'd like to see here.
I'm embarrassed that I provide a vehicle for some of you to behave the way you do.Yeah thanks for painting me as an asshole anyways. It's totally my main goal and everything.
If you want discussions on this forum to be reasonable I'd suggest that pedestal you sometimes place yourself upon be knocked down permanently. Just my two cents.

[Dogg Thang]

Pure had an amazing amount of content for its price.

On this 2048 DLC, it's only free if you have already paid for HD and Fury on PS3. That's a very nice bonus for prior owners of the content and it's still a great deal at the price it's at (if you can get past the performance issues) so you may consider this a technicality but calling it free in a discussion about pricing without the disclaimer that it's not technically free at all would be inaccurate.

[newtype]

Pure had an amazing amount of content for its price.

On this 2048 DLC, it's only free if you have already paid for HD and Fury on PS3. That's a very nice bonus for prior owners of the content and it's still a great deal at the price it's at (if you can get past the performance issues) so you may consider this a technicality but calling it free in a discussion about pricing without the disclaimer that it's not technically free at all would be inaccurate.

I respectfully disagree. They have simply shifted the content to another platform, rather than giving us anything for free. We've already paid for WoHD/Fury, so it would make little sense to charge us again. If you've never invested time in HD/Fury, this is an awesome deal; if you've poured hours into it already, it's disappointing. Further, I find it odd how the devs were responding to the different weight and feel of 2048 as a natural evolution of the product: we didn't want to create the same game over and over again. I can respect that, but then why release 3-4 year old content and make a huge deal out of it? It's all about cross-play.

Given SL's track record, I have chosen to believe that Sony is forcing an agenda upon them in terms of content releases and what functionality 2048 can currently have. There is absolutely no other reason (in my mind) why so many features and old mechanics were left on the cutting room floor. Something similar happened with Killzone 3. There is so much missing coming from KZ2 that it's almost laughable. Same story there: game was rushed, and "major" features that Sony was pushing were wedged into the title: Move support and 3D graphics.

Sony is squeezing these devs and forcing them to create titles that nurture technologies they've developed, rather than simply making solid, AAA games.

I want a Vita just for 2048, but after this DLC and the absence of a solid patch, I think I'll just stick with Pulse and HD/Fury for now.

[Dogg Thang]

I'm not quite sure what part you're respectfully disagreeing with...

It's weird how much the performance varies in these tracks. Vineta K is shockingly bad, running at a very low res and poor frame rate. Yet Metropia runs well and seems to run mostly at full res. Moa Therma, back to shocking again. I wonder what's in those poorly performing tracks that causes the Vita to struggle. I'd love to get screenshots to compare the resolution differences but they've seemingly disabled the screenshot feature here.

[Hacker X]

We've already paid for WoHD/Fury, so it would make little sense to charge us again. If you've never invested time in HD/Fury, this is an awesome deal; if you've poured hours into it already, it's disappointing. Further, I find it odd how the devs were responding to the different weight and feel of 2048 as a natural evolution of the product: we didn't want to create the same game over and over again. I can respect that, but then why release 3-4 year old content and make a huge deal out of it? It's all about cross-play.





That logic doesn't match up with the current business model of most current crossplay/multiplatform PS3/Vita game. Most of the games for Vita that are also PS3 retail games, are not free on Vita, and they are more expensive. Wipeout HD/FURY are cheaper games, and have been given to current PS3 version owners of those games as free content for Vita. And its not like its a direct port. The game had to be altered, and tweaked to play on the Vita, so time and money has gone into the port, yet it is still free. Look at the DLC for Super Star Dust. That alone was like $8.

Now you are right, this game is most likely being controlled by Sony as a show of Vita's capabilities for cross-platform, but like I said in the other post, you are not getting overcharged for anything as of yet, as far as this game, and we WILL continue to get content, whether it is bug fixes, free add-ons, tweaks, and paid-for DLC. We know this from SL's track record. At this point the game has only been out for 4 months. The dev team is small so we will just have to be patient for more content.

There is a lot more work involved in game creation/politics so some of this stuff will just take time.

[qazxswplmnko]

I was really hoping we'd get an equivalent of 2048's speed laps, only because they were already in the main game, so why not the HD/Fury pack? Infinite laps around my favorite tracks... :beer

[Medusa]

....

In the past we've had the privilege of Linky explaining why & how he came up with the physics for the anti-gravity system, and Colin Berry explaining why certain tracks were designed the way they were.

There's no corporate remit that tells them to interact with the fan communities. They're doing it on their own personal time (heck, Colin got embroiled in a Barrel Roll debate during the Xmas break in 2007) and, for the most part, Sony turns a blind eye to it.
...
I'm embarrassed that I provide a vehicle for some of you to behave the way you do.

I remember in particular the barrel roll debate, and being one of the absolutely vehement BR haters posting at that time. I'm somewhat embarrassed myself at the strength of some of my posts from back then, but at the same time, I am extremely passionate about this series, and it was that very debate and the interactions with the developers that taught me very important lessons about wipeout and its future. The major ones I can think of off the top of my head are:

1. There will never be any going back to the total style of the original 3 wipeouts, for many, many reasons. Financial, social, you name it.
2. Each time a new wipeout is made, the individuals making it try to put their own stamp on it. I believe Colin said "Make it our game." I'd search that if I had the time to get the quote correct. (Misquoting is a sin and look what I just did.)
3. Sony pulls the strings, pays the bills, and cuts the ropes. So regardless of what the developers may think and what we here post about, in the end it's up to the vague entity known as Sony Corp. who gives power to people ABOVE Sony Liverpool who do NOT care personally about the WipEout franchise. That includes the fact they want to sell this game to every single gamer across the earth, not just the small fraction of hardcore Wipeout pilots who can actually tell the difference in handling between games (and indeed ships within games).

I really wish there was some way to wrap up all the information from that time in a sticky and post it at the top of each forum.

Infoxicated, this vehicle that allows us to embarrass ourselves has taught me much about what to expect and when to give up. Like many I've just given up. In my eyes, the HD barrel roll switch was the sweetest, saddest gift to fans. I really appreciate what the SL folks did to apply that option. It showed how much they cared about the fans' opinions IMO.

These days, I see a few random posts and threads about wishlists for game options that are completely ridiculous (from newbies, but still), as if they want the entire game rewritten to be some sort of weird non-Wipeout racing driving fighting game...if it doesn't resemble any of the wipeouts to date, maybe it won't happen hmmm? It's very evident which fans have studied even more than one wipeout, let alone the whole series. Maybe those fans would be more active here if there was a return of development-involved posters. I have to admit it was Hacker X's posts that induced me to read this whole thread when I'm virtually never on here anymore.

Don't give up on WipeoutZone. This place is capable of more, just like has been said.

[Temet]

@Hacker X : Yes HD/Fury was cheap! It could have been higher price but take in consideration that there is not a single new race in the game, all comes from Pulse and Pure (OK, reverse Pure are new...).
And the DLC for 2048 is not free for me as I owe the Bluray disc. Anyway, paying again is not a problem for me, I just would have prefered everyone to get the same treatment. Moreover, SL has worked on the DLC, so I would consider normal that it's not free.

[mangaroo]

Also bear in mind it doesn't say 1/3 crossplay available on the back of the box. It just says crossplay.


(Big) Edit: the point is that it is shady, wasn't saying it was illegal. Just another to the list that never existed before 2048. Having said that, been playing Sol 2 a hell of a lot :) But if I had to pay for the content, no I wouldn't be as pleased.

Screw it I'll go further. Releasing the dlc with such bad framerate issues unlike any of the previous wipeout content. Multiplayer on crossplay is basically 15-20 fps. [it is actually better on single player and much more playable (20-25+ ish). For Crossplay I've only been able to host not join others atm despite router settings - being the host might be why I'm losing an extra 5fps online?]....yes it is a buttload of fantastic content but these are still serious issues. The icons.......wouldn't even add a simple racebox to HD/fury sp so it doesn't shine light on 2048's current lack of the most simplest and crucial of features which results in you having to [B]memorize the location of your favourite offline hd/fury events. Look at the end of the day, I hold the wipeout devs to higher standard when it came to producing some amazing things.

I don't take back what I said but they are still some of the best devs around (ever) and still behind a wonderful game. I'm sure it was not an easy feat but I expected even more. Track selection and a stable framerate (I would have thought) is a pretty basic need and is reasonable...in any generation. Not something I should have to wait and hope they add in later if I've been a good boy.

Wow looks like I've missed quite a bit actually...let me catch up. Anyway if they fix the issues all is forgiven, would have preferred not to have them in the first place but a headsup acknowledgement of what the fans are going through is worthwhile, and isn't impossible.

Wow, the websites closing?

I understand they take pride in their game and so they should, they've made one of the best game series and I spread that to most of my friends and actually online a lot too. That being said you can't expect the fans not to point out things which are crucial to be missing. It is a simple track selection screen and some communication, SCEE really that evil? I don't know anyone that justifies sending hate messages and exaggerated problems but just say it like it is - ok Facebook has been a lot worse. If we have no control or influence just tell us to stfu and I'll make the most out of it. As others say, some people let their passion get the better of themselves, others just point out their thoughts. I don't think we should persecute those people (dark..) for saying it how it is as opposed to hiding it under covers so others don't see? Maybe we will get a racebox on launch with the next wipeout. I think most people try hard to be respectful as they can even when they feel strongly about the game because they recognise it's ****ing wipeout, nothing else like it and some ridiculously talented people are working on it. [So why no selection screen yet.]

Very bad mood (irrelevant to wipeout) but it's how I've been feeling about it. Hope no one at Sony liverpool takes offence, I hold you all in the highest regard when it comes to game development (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-wipeout-2048-tech-interview) and I eagerly (http://imgur.com/lL5rT) await updates.

Be respectful and mindful that it is a company at the end of the day. Getting the impression that admins are saying have faith that they will fix things and stay quiet, which I will do but got to understand pretty difficult due to the situation and can't expect everyone to. I can imagine that it is frustrating running a fan site and having others speak badly about it but I am sure they realise this site only benefits the community. Better to release frustrations somewhere then give up on the game...

[Boycey83]

Well Sony made the word crossplay up, so it means whatever they say it means.

The point of all this is to show a fully functional PS3 game on a handheld. This is a fairly astonishing technical achievement, even although it is not without it's issues. Sony have almost certainly made this their priority so that they can send a message to customers/other developers/the press that the Vita is capable of current gen experiences on the go.

[infoxicated]

Yeah thanks for painting me as an asshole anyways.
No problemo, although to be fair you make it so easy.


If you want discussions on this forum to be reasonable I'd suggest that pedestal you sometimes place yourself upon be knocked down permanently.
Noted. And we can make that happen.

This site, this forum has three weeks left to live. The domain name expires then.

That's my way out after 11.5 years and I'm done with it because of people like you.

Bet you've never been happier. :)

Best make good use of it between now and then.

[Darkdrium777]

Oh sure, I'm a big asshole for asking if it were possible maybe that the devs could come back here and share a good time with us all, blame the website closing on me why don't you?
I can't be interested at all in someone like Stuart Tilley doing an AMA (Ask Me Anything), because I totally don't have some questions I could ask. Neither do other people. Questions like "What's it like being a game designer?" or "What type of software do you use to make games?" or "If you were on the development team way back when, do you have any interesting and or comical situations you can share with us?" for a few of the simple ones I had in mind.
I can't be interested in someone like Zico Liu bumping in from time to time and pissing us all off in the Arena section of the forums by setting another impossible time.
I'm not interested in audio and graphics guys signing up for a friendly competition between Zone people and SL people.
Nope. I'm a big asshole who wants to shut down WipEoutZone, because damn it all I hate this website. Is that right?

Okay. Whatever man, I'll be your scapegoat.

Don't you think you are over-reacting? Don't you see that I miss the value this forum had, and want it to return to a bit of it's former glory? You yourself mentioned about devs butting in quite often way back when, and how you miss it. That's exactly what I want. I've never been a part of it but I wish I could be a part of it again.

But fine, shut it down. You've made your decision. I just hope you don't regret it. But I will. Despite what you think, I am not happy.

EDIT:
This is for the records only. My one and only conversation with I believe Ami on Facebook. (http://i.imgur.com/U2xZv.png) As you can see, I have been nothing but cordial and to the point. I'm not who you think I am Rob, and I hope through this you can see that maybe perhaps you are over-reacting. You can ask Ami if I've doctored any of this, but I hope you can trust me. If you still don't trust me, even after such a long time during which I've done my best to hold up the promise I made to you years ago, ask Ami.

EDIT: A plea.
If the love of the game is gone for you, fine. I just ask that you pass it on, as the love of the game burns brightly within many others. Please don't forget.
Heck I'd pay for a part of it if I had a credit card or a way to give you money. It might delay what I want to purchase with that money but I sincerely don't give a crap.
This place can't just up and die like that.

Now I am sad. I hope you see what I mean in this post, and what I truly mean. Not my sarcasm directed at your misguided invectives.

[MarcoM]

Best make good use of it between now and then.

Come on man, don't close it down. Neglect your impulses. Please give it some thougths.

[infoxicated]

Okay. Whatever man, I'll be your scapegoat.
I'm not making you a scapegoat - you're volunteering for the position.

It dawned on me recently that it's my 40th birthday in a few weeks time and I've spent almost the last 12 years of my life having stuff like this directed at me:


If you want discussions on this forum to be reasonable I'd suggest that pedestal you sometimes place yourself upon be knocked down permanently. Just my two cents.
So screw it, if I'm actually getting in the way of folk being reasonable on this place (although I can't for the life of me see why, from way up here on this pedestal) , I'm finally happy to oblige.

[MarcoM]

Hey Infoxicated, I just recently turned 40 also. With age comes wissdom, or so they say.

Be sensible, haters gonna hate.

I actually enjoy this forum very much. I have been interested in WO since Pure. Then I drifted away a bit. But with the Vita my interest has been relaunched.

Keep it alive.

[Darkdrium777]

although I can't for the life of me see whyYou can't see why?
You referred to a portion of your userbase as children and said you were embarrassed for providing a vehicle through which I transmit my ideas about how to improve communications and return this forum to a nice happy place. Ideas which I formulated in a very polite and cordial way. And that's just in this thread.
If you don't see how insulting that is, I'm afraid I can't help you.
There are ways to ask people to be civil without, yes, placing yourself on a higher level than them.
If this criticism is what irritates you, man... Yes, you are forty years old. Happy birthday, sincerely.
But it's never too late to learn to take some criticism.

I don't like saying this, because I am telling you how to run your website. I don't like it.
But this is something I noticed, and that I feel you've done against me in many of the recent exchanges we had.
Perhaps you hate me. I can't see why, so feel free to explain. I'm dying for an answer. Criticize me as I have done to you.

But don't shut this place down because you don't like my ideas, or because you don't like me criticizing just this one aspect of how you run this place. You've done a commendable job for the last twelve years for everyone here, and I can respect that. I just ask that you consider improving this aspect, because as I've said I've noticed it.
This is all.

I'm ready to talk to you about this. The Skype name is the same without the 777.
Tomorrow I will be available.

[Medusa]

Infoxicated deserves a pedestal for keeping this place going as long as he has, through significantly shitty periods and forum drama that keeps reoccurring. Sure we're all equal but he's the one that has kept this place up and spent God knows how many years in time working on it. On a personal level, really, would you have kept going this long? Really? (Yes I'm aware others have helped out lately)
It will be complete and utter shame to have this website and domain name gone, but if there isn't anyone else to run it, you can't fault infoxicated for stepping down and letting it go.
Twelve years is a long time and keep in mind how many of those years have been generally about the games he's not even "that fond of."

“I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.” This is so much more true in forums with a userbase who do not all have the same mother tongue. Plus, half the time those of us who grew up speaking English can't communicate our ideas in an understandable manner. There are bound to be a lot of misunderstandings.

Why am I even posting this?!!

How about that DLC, it must be great to have more Vita players in the HD lobbies....
that's all I've got.

[Hellfire_WZ]

Guys, I appreciate that you want to discuss this issue, but this thread has taken a wild swing off topic now. Any more discussion on this matter, please take it to PM.

[mangaroo]

Awesome :) Will someone confirm the bug I found regarding framerate..starting to think may be the only one with the issue...dodgy download. It is pretty much perfect offline now, the only issue I get is easily solved by pausing and resuming....check the bug report thread for full details..

>> but occasionally (on metropia especially) it will load with a terrible framerate and just stay locked to it. Venom speed speed lap with significantly worse framerate than phantom full race! easily noticeable to any of you..after about 10 seconds into the race. All I had to do to fix it each time was hit pause and resume...don't even have to delay the resuming. Instant fix :S

I also still haven't been able to join a game strangely...keep working on those settings but anyone? It automatically goes into the selection screen to host your own. Always get a few people joining...was wondering what your experiences were? The framerate was bad when I was hosting....maybe it was the bug and I never paused/resumed due to MP not sure. This would hopefully mean even fewer issues and a simple patch to fix the framerate :D As it is totally playable otherwise. Not confident about online yet.

edit: updated the specifics of encountering the metropia bug in the proper thread.

[Darkdrium777]

On a personal level, really, would you have kept going this long? Really?If I had any capacity in coding up a website or running a server or maintaining a forum or even moderating it, I would definitely help. I have zero experience in such things, which is why I appreciate what he has done. In my current state, I could not have done it, but the will to do it is there I assure you. I am also inexperienced in online finances and how to send money to him for him to keep going, so I feel terrible about that too.
The only experience I have is providing shitty not even made in photoshop avatars and web design mockups, and maintaining the WipEout PurE download links. It's absolute crap compared to what he's done for sure. Still, it's the only way I know to help or contribute. Both of which would be impossible without this website, so then again we come full circle.

That's all I wanted to say. I won't post about this anymore in here. Sorry Hellfire.
I'm open to PMs.

[yawnstretch]

Don't know what's going on in this thread (just popped to the end and don't have time right now) but I'm sensing a lot of tension.

Peace dudes! Soak up some HD on vita if you can - tis blissful.

[Hacker X]

Well, for what its worth, to Infoxicated, and anyone else whom has helped to keep this site up all this time, I appreciate what was created here. I'm not sure how long some of these people on this site have been playing Wipeout, but I know that when you go back to days of Wipeout 1-3, it was incredibly difficult to find news or a following on this series. I think that during the Wipeout 3 era there were websites up by then Psygnosis for very lite WO screensavers and such, but that was prettymuch all there was to see.

There may have been some WO forums back then, but if there were, they were generic sites that did not have sponsorship from the Wipeout devs, or WO fans simply didn't know about them, so there was a struggle for fans to get new info of what was going on with the game. Wipeoutzone.com was a God-send for Wipeout fans, but one of the things that has kept the WO scene going were the hardcore WO fans, that loved the game for its good and its bad, and were dare I say, more respectable then they are to day, cause truth-be-told, we were hungry for more of ANYTHING from this game series.

During the the past 8 years, I have seen a trend with gamers getting more and more unappreciative of games, some warranted, some unwarranted. In the case of Wipeout (Besides WO Fusion, which I still jokingly criticize as worst of the series) it is very unwarranted due to what we have gotten out of the WO releases since Wipeout Pure. I don't care if some of you don't like what I am saying, but at this point, some of you have just gotten so nasty, and aggressive towards this series, that I its getting to the point where its just not fun to be a part of this community anymore. The WO community of old is what has kept this cult following going. Without that community the WO scene is NOTHING. The game is not making a lot of money but its following has always been special enough to make it a niche series that is backed by a stylistic/futuristic design, gameplay that can only be toppled by the most elite followers, and a community that has backed the game through thick and thin.

If the community can get over the bickering and also turn their constant SL complaints into constructive feedback, instead of destructive criticisms then maybe we will be able to hold onto the magic of the WO following, otherwise, if it is time to end, then it is time to end, but it sure has been one heck of a ride.

Qirex RD for life!

[Darkdrium777]

In my own case (if ever some criticism I've made appeared that way), it is my wish for the game to be more successful and widely known that drove me to post some of the criticism I have done. I only wish for it's success. This love of the game for me is still very present. WipEout 2048 is a great game, but I love WipEout so much that I want it to have what it's currently missing. If it gets that, and they fix all the little bugs, it will be the best WipEout game ever. Well, of this millennium.
I like that they've done this DLC, and I am very glad that it is free. When I first heard about the Vita and what it was supposed to be as a platform, I immediately imagined WipEout HD Fury running on it in all it's glory. Here we are, and I love that just as I had imagined. Yet, there is this snag, this imperfection which I feel tarnishes the beauty of this game. A snag which I hope to the gods almighty they will fix.
I don't believe this to be unwarranted criticism, or that I am unappreciative of what they have done. I do recommend WipEout 2048 to people that ask about it online, because I know it's a great game. It really needs racebox and lobbies though. I believe I'm fair in that assessment.

[Amorbis]

I don't think anyone here is criticising 2048 because they hate it, but rather because they enjoy it and would like to see it do better, as Darkdrium has said.

It is usually the case that the harshest critics are the fans because of their passion. For example criticism aimed at Sonic 4, which by itself is a great game, but compared to Sonic games of old loses its shine. I think the same can be applied here to an extent, where 2048 is great but due to time constraints put on development it has yet to reach its potential. The release of HD content is only helping it get to where it needs to be, plus the fact it's free helps.

[Dogg Thang]

It's not free.

As for criticising due to hate, no. Hate is a very strong word and it's not something I'd apply to 2048. But unfortunately for me it would be incorrect to say that I would criticise it because I enjoy it. I may criticise it because I enjoy Wipeout generally however and don't feel this lives up to the potential of the series, and maybe that's what you mean? But there is an extent to which that is simply my problem, not SL's. We've moved in different directions.

With HD and Fury DLC though, my own disappointments are just on technical performance and little else. In a game that has been and still is the visual showcase for what the Vita can do, the hit some of these tracks take came as quite a surprise to me, especially in the resolution (far from earning the name HD on some). It would be nice to think they could patch that but I'm guessing much of it comes down to the design. Looking at which tracks run well and which don't, I'm wondering if most of it comes down to the busy detailing on the surface of the actual racing track itself on some tracks. Detail that never would be missed if they smoothed it out. I could be wrong of course - it could be something else entirely.

[leungbok]

About that hd/fury DLC, i must admit it's a great addition to the vita. It's smoother than i thought, graphically astonishing for an handheld, the handling is just fine, BRs works perfectly. I bought it because i took the decision to play on vita under my second account but the price is very cheap for the content.
It's awesome and a must have for those who don't own a ps3 or HD/FURY on it, but i personnaly wait for something new for the main game 2048, still with features which gives more choices to the players. :+

[chalovak]

Some of you maybe remember that I sold my Vita 2 month ago, well I'm back in the game! Couldn't resist not having handheld HD and Fury, lol.
What can I say... Now we're talking!! Really enjoy this add on.
Oh, and please, add me to a friend list, I'd really like to race you, people. )))
my psn name: chalovak

[mangaroo]

Knew it wouldn't last... Welcome back :D

Btw anyone noticed on a particular detonator event (don't have the vita with me atm) in the fury campaign, it is on the amphesium and as it resets back to the start line there is a very tall drop. It seems almost random how to land the drop without resetting the ship? I've tried doing dual-airbrakes and just twitching as you land...but seems a bit harsh! Will edit with specifics later. Reminds me of the Sol zone mode video i made with the auricom prototype (heavy ship) at about zone 45 starting to drop through the track. In this it just resets.

[MarcoM]

Some of you maybe remember that I sold my Vita 2 month ago, well I'm back in the game! Couldn't resist not having handheld HD and Fury, lol.
What can I say... Now we're talking!! Really enjoy this add on.
Oh, and please, add me to a friend list, I'd really like to race you, people. )))
my psn name: chalovak

Hi, I added you. But beware, I am one of the slower ones. Still gotta beat the Final race in 2050. I never will probably. :(

[Temet]

Since someone wrote the tricks :
- set PSVita in flight mode to avoid crashed when ending a race;
- When framerate is bad, just press start to pause and then unpause and the framerate is good.

... I admit that the offline is nice.

Of course, the same big feature named "Racebox" is missing, but the quality of the conversion is technically very good.

[MarcoM]

And it would be even better if the icons when you finish a race would indicate what type of event it is. But that has already been said. And it would be solved by adding racebox.