Weapon pad reloading delay...

[Temet]

Dear all,

With the recent vids of WO2048, some things look good : weapon slow you dawn way fewer than in HD, it looks like you can choose offensive/defensive weapons... but I noticed that it still takes ages for a weapon pad to reload.

I suppose lots of you have spent 2 laps with no weapon, chasing an opponent.

So, here is the thing, what is your opinion on the subject?

Maybe if we can get a clear decision on the topic, we could address it to SL, I assume it's just a hardcoded var to modify...

Thanks.

Temet

[leungbok]

Pads seems to be aligned on wipeout 2048 due to the wider tracks, so if the ship in front of you stole you an item, choose the pad just at the right/left ! ;)

[Temet]

And if you're forth ? :)
And if the guy in front of you takes all offensive pads so that you can only prey for a boost ?

[JABBERJAW]

Should be no delay, in any wipeout, only acceleration ships get them in the beginning

[Medusa]

See the first three wipeouts.

[leungbok]

Should be no delay
And it perfectly works on online eliminator mode anyway !

[Slacker]

See the first three wipeouts.
They had delays. At least, I'm very sure they did.

[amplificated]

Random weapon pickups are fundamentally unfair anyway, so I don't care.

[Zynetic]

I personally don't care at all about the weapon delays, since I usually turn them off when I'm able to.

Although think about it this way:

If there weren't any weapon delays in normal racing, the person just behind another craft can easily overtake the one in front, providing they obtain an offensive weapon, as they wouldn't need to aim at all (strictly speaking), because the craft in front of them is at point-blank range (or near enough). This would be really unfair (than it is already), in my opinion, as it really destroys alot of the racing in the game.

Just behind another craft? Oh well, just pick up an instantaneous weapon and blast the person in front of you.

All I can say is: If you really want weapons, work on your racing line and work your way in front of the guy in front of you.

[MrSmadSmartAlex]

It's not just about having the weapons themselves. It's also about the ship in front being able to BR as much as they like, due to being able to absorb, while you're not able to. So you can't take them out with a weapon or catch up, no matter how good your line is.
One solution might be permanent pads with a slight delay on being able to use the weapon, but not a delay on absorbing it.

[Roz]

Or just get rid of barrel rolls, since they never made any sense at all.

[MrSmadSmartAlex]

I don't think that floating ships or pads that make you go faster or make weapons magically appear in your ship make much sense either :D! So that's not a good reason to dislike barrel rolls. No problem if you don't like them, but others do, and they're not objectively bad (or good, for that matter). It's a matter of opinion, not sense.

[F.E.I.S.A.R]

Having played WipEout,WipEout 2097/XL,3,Pure,Pulse and HD,and given the fact that loaded weapon is random,and that realistically,a computer constantly running would crash(the pads have to be operated by SOMETHING),I don't care.

[Roz]

I don't think that floating ships or pads that make you go faster or make weapons magically appear in your ship make much sense either :D! So that's not a good reason to dislike barrel rolls. No problem if you don't like them, but others do, and they're not objectively bad (or good, for that matter). It's a matter of opinion, not sense.

At least for me, pads do make some sense in the wipEout world. You pass through it and the pad triggers a small boost in the thrusters. Or unlocks you a weapon. We can establish that it's a system imposed and regulated by the FX league organization.

I've thought about it and I find no reason barrel rolling should give you a boost in the wipEout world. I like the concept of having to do something extra to give us an edge, but I would prefer something other than the barrel roll animation. It looks silly and out of place and somewhat breaks my immersion.

[Medusa]

There was a slight delay reloading weapon pads in the first three games, but it was slight. Most importantly (IMO) there was never any variation in the length of delay, like pads blacking out for half a lap one time and then blacking out briefly the next time (yet still giving you a weapon after the game thought about it and decided you deserve one...).

If you get really critical about it, there's absolutely nothing that makes sense in Wipeout. Should that mean they can change the game however they want and still give it the same title? I don't think so. But I don't hold the copyright, do I?

[amplificated]

Roz, just think that by barrel rolling, the craft use the extra friction to generate energy in a special capacitor that discharges in the result of a small boost when the ship's A-G drive meets resistance (and can only be charged - just enough for one boost - when the A-G drive has no resistance).

It makes perfect sense. At least, more than enough sense in a world with anti-gravity and ships that can absorb material objects through the air, which once on board don't even affect drag, weight distribution, or tax the rocket's payload and slow the ship down.

Also, +1 for thinking it looks silly. That's a first, lol. This new game announcement has really drawn the anti-BR brigade out of the woodwork.

[Roz]

Well yes that could work indeed. Although one would have to wonder if a barrel roll wouldn't disorient the pilot of an insanely fast ship inside a very narrow circuit (although 2048 solves that part, har!).

Still looks silly though!

[Temet]

Please friends, not yet another debate on BR.
There have been so many discussions about it already... some like, some hate, some don't care...
Keep on the initial question ;)

And take me for an eternal unsatisfied, I'm very pleased to have a new Wipeout and recent videos are really great.

This delay was just the small detail I felt wrong on the vid.

And you can't compare with Old Wipeouts, because the issue is mainly online, in a room with several players. This was not possible before.

Anyway, I'm pleased to see other wipers feel concerned about the question :+

[Kyonshi]

One thing that was mentioned some while ago here (i think its was ProblemSolver's idea) was that weapon pads should turn into speed pads the minute the weapon have been picked up, for all the duration of the pad cooldown. Personally, that would be the best thing ever, and all problems would be resolved.

Barrel rolls could stay with the additional speed pads opportunity. Also, the perpetual curse of being at the mercy of the front and rear opponents when passing on an inactive pad would be somewhat relieved. Personally im quite fed up having my face bombarded with Bombs and Mines by the front guy and having my ass shot with rockets, missiles and what not, while i cant retaliate in any way.

If the pads arent turned into speed pads, completely remove the cooldown or put a speed pad beside/in front/behind of every weapon pads.

[leungbok]

Although one would have to wonder if a barrel roll wouldn't disorient the pilot of an insanely fast ship inside a very narrow circuit
Ok, silly animation stuffs that makes the game harder to play, i know why i love BRs ! :D

[ZixXer]

One thing that was mentioned some while ago here (i think its was ProblemSolver's idea) was that weapon pads should turn into speed pads the minute the weapon have been picked up, for all the duration of the pad cooldown. Personally, that would be the best thing ever, and all problems would be resolved.

Barrel rolls could stay with the additional speed pads opportunity. Also, the perpetual curse of being at the mercy of the front and rear opponents when passing on an inactive pad would be somewhat relieved. Personally im quite fed up having my face bombarded with Bombs and Mines by the front guy and having my ass shot with rockets, missiles and what not, while i cant retaliate in any way.

If the pads arent turned into speed pads, completely remove the cooldown or put a speed pad beside/in front/behind of every weapon pads.

Wow thats a great idea! but i can imagen that some guys set up players at all the wepon pads just to get a wr in a online game....

[Dogg Thang]

It's an interesting idea but, unless there was a way of regulating it, there would be a constant stream of follow the leader going on. In many cases, especially towards the finish line, the guaranteed boost being worth more than the random chance of a desired weapon. It could completely change all race tactics - not in itself a bad thing but the results of which would need to be carefully considered and tested.

I also think the cool down helps prevent people just staying on your ass, waiting for you to go for a weapon and then blast you immediately after. It promotes wider tactics and proper overtaking. There are plenty of weapon pads and nobody will hit them all, or should need or want to. As SmartAlex mentioned, the issue in more recent WO games is the advantage it gives when coupled with barrel rolls and the absorption mechanic. But that's a problem with those elements more than the weapon pad cool down.

[leungbok]

but i can imagen that some guys set up players at all the wepon pads just to get a wr in a online game....
Online SR WR needs more turbo pick ups than speedpads ;)

[Aeroracer]

random weapons are crap..always have been alows a crap player to beat a good player provided you get lucky.
i beat players who i know were better than me just cos i got lucky with the pads.frustrating after you put in many hours practice only to be unlucky with pads on the track..

reload times are crap too..ok for two player games like leungbok pointed out but on 8 player games its just luck again or just drop back to last..

my preffered solution is pre set pads with same weapons on them always available with no reload time..then you can build a stategy around the pads.

or even better alow the players to decide and just give us an option for reload times and pre fixed weapons per pad or random.at least we can choose what pleases us..

[Coaster1235]

At first I didn't care for the prefixed weapon pads idea, but now that I think about it it just might fit into WO2048... the way they sprinkle the weapon pads everywhere being hardly missable, prefixed weapons would add an element of strategy to it, and a good reason to learn the track. Of course there would be lots of potential ways to screw it up, but it could add at least some kind of incentive towards thinking your racing lines. That, or just a bunch of noobs accusing you of cheating for your generous quaking.

[Medusa]

To be perfectly honest, I think I would be happy with the delay if they could only manage to make it consistent in online play! Faster would be nice, but if nothing else at least some consistency...please!
(If that's even possible with all the lag.)