FAST - New WipEout-Style WiiWare Game

[Amorbis]

Shin'en have announced a new Wii futuristic racing title called FAST Racing League. Details are limited at the moment, but there is a teaser site with a very WipEout-esque ship on it and the phrase 'Shift Your Phase. Win The Race'. Shin'en have a good track record with their games, so hopefully it won't be another mild disappointment like Fatal Inertia.

Here's the teaser site (http://fast.shinen.com/) and here's the product page on their site (http://www.shinen.com/games/game.php3?fast).

[nexekho]

I am all for more games of this kind, but I can't imagine the Wii's a good platform for them (very underpowered, single core 500mHz PPC/ten year old ATi bag of ass and the Wiimotes have an excruciatingly poor response to twist; can't determine it from gravity) and the craft is a bit _too_ similar for my liking.

Might be fun to try though.

[OBH]

From the picture alone it should say "based off the wipeout series" in my opinion :)

Its uncanny.

[BulletWraith]

haha yeh a total rip, looks great though:g

@nexekho what does the hardware have to do with whether or not its going to a good game or not?


-zer:burgershen

[JABBERJAW]

"very underpowered, single core 500mHz PPC/ten year old ATi "

what about a 33mhz system? seems to me the best Wipeout games were on that :)

agreed with the wiimote though. Although, HD is not bad to play with motion sensing, but the damn pitch should be on the dpad. Why wasn't that an option? maybe I'll make a thread

[nexekho]

@nexekho what does the hardware have to do with whether or not its going to a good game or not?

A lot, actually. The better the hardware is the more time the developers can spend tuning and perfecting the gameplay and a better, smoother, more consistent framerate can be had. With more RAM, you can store bigger and more complex maps in memory. With the extra processing power you can use a script engine rather than native code which makes debugging faster and easier, leading to more stable code which is quicker to write therefore easier to get right and it means you can do more!

Not to mention that it seems that people just can't program any more. I mean, seriously, Photoshop has got to be the slowest program I have ever used. How has it changed in functionality since 1995? It has extensions, yes, but there is still no explaination as to why the smudge tool is so damned slow.

[LurifaxFlux]

Lol, at first I thought I was actually looking at the EG-X HD ship xD

Too bad I don't have a Wii :P
Don't think I'll get one either as long as I live alone.

[Amorbis]

The ship does look a lot like EG-X and even Tigron to an extent. The game can't really go wrong as long as it doesn't enforce poorly implemented motion control, I find using the d-pad just fine.

If it turns out to be any good it might just be the first thing I buy off the Wii store, even though I've had a Wii for over a year. :|

[billychanxtr33m]

teaser site isnt particularly interesting.... but who knows, this may turn out nice

[Amorbis]

There's an image floating about the interwebs of the game:

http://www3.pic-upload.de/02.09.10/nc7y2s4gmbdr.jpg

This picture suggests that there might be Gamecube control so no silly motion control. The screenshot looks a lot like WipEout, but the slogan 'shift your phase' and teaser image suggest there might be some Ikaruga style colour changing.

[Lance]

I'm with Al and zerOshen on this one. The hotness of the hardware has nothing to do with the excellence of the game. Bigger maps have no direct relationship to better play. More memory and more processor speed have none, either. It's about the quality of the game design, the imagination and goals of the designers. Without those, the tools are worthless.

[nexekho]

The hotness of the hardware has nothing to do with the excellence of the game.

It does these days. The awesome programmers who wrote a software renderer that can kick out a game like Wipeout on a turgid x86 with no hardware acceleration were let go because they're more expensive than two idiots who can do the same job badly. That or they worked their way into the management. Why do you think newer software is slow, unstable and bloated? The iPhone, for instance, can kick out beautiful graphics at a solid 60fps if the developers have a clue, but from what I've seen most of the stuff stutters around at 10-20fps because the people behind the apps don't know how to put a room on the screen without over-engineering everything in sight.

Smoother running games can go faster because more frames are being thrown up on the screen, giving you more information and therefore more time to react.

Again, more excess power equals easier ways to develop more complex games both in gameplay and graphics and if it takes less time to develop the game more time can be spent hand-tuning the gameplay.

It does make a difference whether you like it or not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wirth's_law

[BulletWraith]

@ Amorbis
hey just wondering if you can post the screenshot or whatever it is directly on these forums as it won't show up for me at it's.de adderess

cheers
zer:burgershen

[Amorbis]

Sure, I'll add it to this post. And sorry for embedding it before, I didn't think it was that big.

[SaturnReturn]

...The better the hardware is the more time the developers can spend tuning and perfecting the gameplay...

I just edited a snippit of that, but as a general point I'd agree with those who say the hardware doesn't matter as much as you're stating. It's not that I disagree with what you're saying, it's just that I think you're trying to relate quantifiable things like time with subjective things such as vision and excellence. Some of the games I enjoy the most on my PS3 are pretty basic games, and I can't imagine they need such powerful hardware. Maybe they're the kind of game that is actually cheaper to develop these days, but that's yet another variable to introduce to the equation.

As an aside, that Wirth's Law seems to be implying that more powerful hardware doesn't actually make things faster, or did I read it wrong?

[nexekho]

As an aside, that Wirth's Law seems to be implying that more powerful hardware doesn't actually make things faster, or did I read it wrong?

Faster hardware does make older software faster. But newer software is bogged down by inexplicable bloat because of bad programming practice as in the past programmers found their own understanding of maths and code whereas today they are taught in schools and universities where people who couldn't make it in the industry ingrain bad practices and mindlessly bureaucratic methods that instigate bloat for no real benefit. If you gave someone on the industry today with roughly the same amount of experience as the developers who built the original Wipeout the hardware and tools they had, they'd be too busy with their head stuck in an object-orientated overcomplicated mess to get anything done. To get a program working nicely with today's programmers you either have to go seriously spartan or live with miserable juddering, lagging framerates.

[JABBERJAW]

Lets look at two games, say wipeout xl and waverace 64. Both of those games would be very limited visually for today standards, and the framerate is slower than wipeout hd or waverace blue storm. However, both are better playing than HD or blue storm (imo). The physics model in XL is amazing, and I have been waiting for ANY game to have a physics model that matches it. NO game has even come close. Same with waverace 64. blue storm feels stiff in comparison, and I haven't seen anything remotely close to the physics in that either. I have seen plenty of games run smoother, but not better. While great graphics with 60fps,framerates are awesome, they do not make a game better than a game running with poor graphics, and 30 fps. Now if the same exact physics are for both, obviously you would take the better graphics, but we won't see that unless Nick Burcombe is running the next wo game(or infox :) ). I think because they are so interested in making the graphics so good, the gameplay suffers every single time for any game, unless perhaps you are EA with unlimited resources.

[eLhabib]

Look at it! (http://www.fast.shinen.com/)
It's basically a straight ripoff! We'll see how it plays tho...

[JABBERJAW]

my guess is there is no pitch control, and even though it looks like wipeout, it will play like fzero, add in some catch up, and you have an unplayable game, just like 95% of the other futuristic racers out there. . Even with the skepticism, I hope it is better than wipeout. I don't care who makes the game, as long as it plays great.

OH yeah, c'mon El Habib, seriously, not a rip off! The year was clearly set for 2112, far after even the original wipeout :) , so it is obviously different

[Darkdrium777]

So it's WipEout ships on F-Zero tracks with a new gameplay mechanic (Assuming the promotional talk on the website is true.)

Call me biased but I like much more how WipEout is F1 as F-Zero is Nascar. If you see what I mean ;)

We'll see if that gameplay change is worth it or if it's just frivolous. I'm betting on frivolous however, generally games of a certain genre that incorporate a new gameplay mechanic fail hard because that gameplay mechanic is badly implemented.

Also it's not the first thread on this game ;)

[eLhabib]

... WipEout is F1 as F-Zero is Nascar...

I like that comparison. Dead on! :+

[LurifaxFlux]

Alredy a thread for this ;)
http://wipeoutzone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7681

Edit: Threads were merged :)

[eLhabib]

whoops, sorry!

[Xpand]

Looks like a mix between Track mania and Wipeout...

[Sausehuhn]

One thing about this game we can surely say by now: It cannot match up to WipEout's graphic style.

Oh and I don't mean the graphics, I mean the interface design.

[Amorbis]

There's some more information available in two interviews:

http://leakybattery.wordpress.com/2010/10/04/fast-racing-league-interview/

http://www.siliconera.com/2010/10/08/behind-the-dashboard-of-fast-racing-league/

The phasing sounds like an interesting element, should make for some strategy in the race. Sadly the multiplayer is local only, but it does seem to have a lot to do in the game.

[Darkdrium777]

Meh, whoever it was didn't really answer this question which is probably the most important to answer if you want to get any fans of the genre on board. I don't care about the plastic wheel money-sucker thingamajig.


Is the control/animation floaty like Wipeout, or more snappy and instant like F-Zero?

[Amorbis]

FAST is finally out now, on the Wii for 1000 points from the Wii Shopping Channel.

You can see the latest trailer on YouTube here (mind the comments): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWlFi3zbOz0

60fps version of the trailer:
http://fast.shinen.com/video/shinen_fast_trailer_ws_1500kbit.mp4

The game is impressive visually, running at 60fps and one of the best looking games on the Wii. It plays well too if you don't use motion controls, though the controls are a bit simplistic with no air brakes or anything, only phase shift and boost. The phase shifting works well as an alternative to offensive weapons and provides some strategy to the line you take when racing. Comparing it to WipEout it feels most like Pure or Pulse in handling and has difficulty to keep you going.

I'll post some more impressions later when I've had some time to play it.

[F.E.I.S.A.R]

I'm quite worried by the "fan wank" going on in the comments section of the video that Amorbis said to mind the comments of. I guess it is personal preferences.
Two sides of a coin. Played both. both are equally good as futuristic racers. : P

[Flint Fandango]

I haven´t played this game, but on the basis of the video, I think it isn´t fit to hold a candle to WipEout.
Automatic BR´s, some candy like balls on the track to collect and sort of mag cages...sorry, but I won´t give it a break. :?

[Amorbis]

The balls on the track aren't just collectibles for score, they are used for the Phase-shift thing the game does. You have to 'shift your phase' on different parts of the track to clear jumps and get speed boosts from black and white pads on the track, which only activate if you shift to the right colour. If I had a worthy camera or a capture card I would do a gameplay video to show you how it works.

I don't think it's as good as WipEout though, which isn't surprising being a WiiWare game with a 40mb size limit. They did however make the best you can get for a futuristic racing game on the Wii with some new ideas, such as phases.

[RJ O'Connell]

This is without question the best new futuristic racer to come out in the last decade, that isn't a sequel. It's a telling sign that the genre is kind of dead, with Wipeout being the only series consistently putting out any new titles (F-Zero took the previous gen off, games like Rollcage, QR, Extreme G, Fatal Inertia have all died, etc. etc.) and I'm really hoping it can get a more "full-fledged" sequel or at least that more people will spend 1000 Wii Points to play it and give it a chance instead of dismissing it as just another ____ clone.

It starts off easy and slow like Wipeout, but when it gets rolling, the AI is super-aggressive when it comes to boosting and the speed increase is really noticeable - I like how FAST Racing League's "350 mph" is just as fast as "700 km/h" in Wipeout HD, as well. There is a bit of a rubberband effect, though.

Only problems I've seen so far are two instances of dropped frames, and the aforementioned rubberband AI. But if you own a Wii and you're looking for a new challenge, go download this game!

[JABBERJAW]

Rubber band ai in multiplayer?

[RJ O'Connell]

Only played single-player so far, sorry.

Tip: Bosuton DT's weight makes it impervious to ice surfaces, other machines will have a much harder time negotiating icy corners such as those on The Chillout.