PS3 cooling.

[Wip3ou7]

but the fans are really loud, and never stop, even if the PS3 is cooled down with inactivity...

Sounds like you need to vacuum out your PS3, mine is silent most of the time and even when the fans are on I never notice it.

[Spece2goin]

it was due to this summer temperature in my room
and i wonder if using the PS3 standing verticaly changes something

anyway, the control scheme of the fans is wrong.
they start to run full speed at a certain temperature, but even if the PS3 cools down to a stable temps where the fans weren't running, they don't stop.
it's obviously an hysteresis, but the lower temperature limit to stop the fans is never reached...

and guess you never had your fans on, or you need to clean your ears, because the PS3 is also known to be very noisy in that case.

there are many games that don't load too much the CPU/GPU/SPU whatever, but there are also games where the fans are unavoidable (SoulCaliburIV, GTA IV)

WOHD was not a part of them until i use the PS3 in my room, verticaly, and the summer takes place...

[AG-wolf]

It depends on what model you have; mine is one with full PS2 backward compatibility, and it burns with the heat of a thousand suns, or 10 first to third model xbox360s, your pick :P (seriously, my ps3 runs hotter than my 360) A friend of mine has one with the partial PS2 compatibility and her's runs just as hot, but multiple other people I know who don't have a ps2 compatible model, theirs runs nice and cool.

If yours is a PS2 compatible model, standing it vertical is probably better... most of the heat tends to come from the right half of the machine, so standing it upright will allow it to escape just a bit easier. Consider using compressed air to blow out all the dust through the vents (front to back is usually the best exist route), because the more dust that builds up on the heat sink fins, the harder it is to dissipate that heat. I don't know how well canned ait will work, I used high-pressure condensed air from my job... it's piped all around the factory, and it's so powerful it will actually break your skin if you spray it on yourself :P

As far as the noise, the fans never slow down because the machine stays at or above the trigger temperature once they engage. The machine only cools down after it's shut off... and that's dangerous too because the fins are still hot, and then all the heat is left stationary inside the console. Your fan noise could also be a sign that your machine badly needs to be dedusted, because I've never once heard my machine's fans despite feeling some heavy heat out of the back... but I also only play Wipeout HD, and I haven't been playing it at all in ambient room temperature above 75 degrees...

Consider an intercooler; they only got a bad rep because the first model for xbox was poorly designed and actually drew its power from the OPERATING power lines of the 360 instead of having its own power source. I have two different models, one that clips onto the right half of the machine and triggers when it senses too much heat, and another that hugs the back AND right side, and plugs in-line the 120v power plug (thus not actually affecting the machine itself). Both designs can get a little noisy, but I'd rather have some noise than a molten pile of metal and plastic.

[Lance]

Hmm.. my room temp is ambient non-airconditioned, often 85 to 90+ degrees Fahrenheit. Those machines would die an early death in my house if they run that hot in 75° F. I've been thinking of adding a PS3 to my collection next year. Perhaps I should stop thinking that. Or use one only in winter.

------

Anyway, about those themes and avatars, I would not pay for them. But I'm a cheap bastard, and tend to be focussed on primary functionality.

[Darkdrium777]

Hmm.. my room temp is ambient non-airconditioned, often 85 to 90+ degrees Fahrenheit. Those machines would die an early death in my house if they run that hot in 75° F. I've been thinking of adding a PS3 to my collection next year. Perhaps I should stop thinking that. Or use one only in winter.http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/8530/55ms9.gif

PS3 80-40-120-250 GB models have reduced power consumption and heat production. Especially the newer 120 and soon to come out 250GB models (The "slims.") Perhaps you've already stopped thinking?

FYI: My 60GB is an older model, with the biggest heat production and power consumption, I've used it this summer when it was well over 23 C (30 C says hello), it hasn't died. It got quite loud (My computer, which is a quad core CPU and nVidia 8800 GTS GPU, too at the same temperature), but that was expected. It hasn't died.

They made a PS3 run in a sauna for a hundred hours and it didn't die (http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/15/extreme-ps3-stress-test-garners-praise-from-sony/).
GPUs are built to withstand internal temperatures of 100C, though it's not recommended to run them at that temperature for long. Under the most stressful conditions of playing UT3, Audiosurf and whatnot at 30C, my nVidia 8800 GTS in my PC got as high as 80C internal temp, not higher. Considering the PS3 is very well built, it's a safe assumption to say that the GPU inside the PS3 doesn't get much hotter, considering it's also based on the previous generation of processors (nVidia 7xxx.)

It's especially stupid to keep saying "Oh I won't get a PS3 because apparently it runs pretty hot and might die" when you bought the very specific console known worldwide for systematic hardware failures due to overheating. Especially when the newer models just announced will have even less troubles than the already existing 40 and 80GB models (Those without PS2 BC) which have no troubles themselves already.

[IH8YOU]

I've probably said this a thousand times by now - but if your PS3 is getting hot - or running excessively loud - blow some compressed air through ALL the ports - while the system is running. Simply vacuuming the ports won't agitate the particulate buildup inside the unit enough. On top of that, vacuums are incredible static generators - and can be risky to use around electronics.

If you have pets that contain fur / hair, a central air system, smokers or just a very dusty environment - you'll definitely have to blow this thing out from time to time.

The PS3 breathes well (this is a good thing) - and as a consequence, it inhales a lot of junk over time. Dust is a great insulator of heat - so the PS3 has to work is @$$ off to keep cool.

Don't confine the thing to a sealed box (death-trap entertainment centers, ect...) - and you should be fine.

[Lance]

It's especially stupid to keep saying "Oh I won't get a PS3 because apparently it runs pretty hot and might die" when you bought the very specific console known worldwide for systematic hardware failures due to overheating.

I did no such thing; I did not buy one of the original models, the ones notorious for, according to your earlier statement, 30 percent failure rates, but instead I bought the very latest model, one made about 2 months before I got it, a model which runs barely warm in 90 degree F ambient temperatures. I am not being fanboyish in having concerns about the behaviour of the models being discussed by Eric, particularly since my consoles must run in more severe conditions than his, and I might therefore hesitate, awaiting further info and hardware news, rather than dash out and buy a reasonably priced used model, which may be truly known by someone's personal experience for running hot in environments more forgiving than the one I live in.



And bless you, sir, for calling my actions, and by extension, me, especially stupid.

[Darkdrium777]

You keep talking about research, news, etc. You have done this for purchasing your Xbox. I am telling you: what you are looking for for the PS3 is out there. Yet you have not done a single thing to look for it. Not a single thing.
I have told you: the newer models run much cooler than the older ones. From personal, hands on experience: FrostE's 40GB was amazingly cool back at Al's place, while my and AG-Wolf's 60GB was hot. We had windows and doors closed and the air conditioning was barely functioning. It was like when I left my 60GB run for a full day on Folding@Home with doors and windows closed in a room with no ventilation, it was really hot in that room and in Al's living room. The test I talk about, with the console running at 120F, was made near launch, it was a 60GB, which runs hotter than the newer models. It ran in a sauna for 108 hours. The new models run cooler than the old, expect by logical extension that they will also be able to run 108 hours at 120F.
The new PS3 slim is designed to run even cooler than the last few of the fat models. It generates less heat by using less power. It is a technical specification you can find posted on many gaming sites now.
I keep telling you this, that there are no significant hardware flaws on the PS3, but each time I read you talking about the PS3, I read "Oh there's this minor annoyance, oh the old models run pretty hot; so I might not buy one new model after all." You expect me to say: "That's very intelligent thinking." I am wasting my time telling you to go out and read, because you won't do it.

TL;DR:

Old models run hot.
New models run cool.

Just like your new XBox model.

Look it up, or don't.

Here: last bits of info on this "heat problem" which isn't even one.
Read here about the PS3's processor die sizes. A smaller die size means the processor will use less energy to run, and will therefore produce less heat.
Look at the evolution of the processor sizes on the charts on this page (http://www.edepot.com/playstation3.html).
Notice how they shrink? As the models get released, the processors get smaller and use less energy. We're down to 65nm/65nm for the most recent fat models. From my experience, the 65/90 model produces much less heat than my 90/90 60GB model.
Now look here (http://www.pcworld.com/article/170482/sonys_ps3_slim_carries_updated_cell_chip.html). The new PS3 slim is a 45/65. 45 nanometers. It's half the size of my processor! Correlation to energy requirements and heat production is not proportional, but you can expect it's gonna be a shitload less than a 90/90!

See, I told you it's out there. You just didn't look well enough and went on thinking there was an issue when there isn't as you might see now.

[Lance]

To Darkdrium: I have read of many people's experiences with the PS3 models here on these forums, and had previously thought that the 40 might be the best one if I bought a used one. As I have stated on another thread here, I am considering buying one of the new slim models, which I checked out online yesterday, and mentioned in that thread that it would be likely to be a cooler running model because of integration and simplification, as well as being cheaper. I would probably regard that as the best value even if it cost more than a used example of the ones being discussed here.

I do not really consider tests in non-real world conditions, but prefer to rely on people's personal experience, particularly when those people seem to be fairly objective.

I do not expect you to say anything positive about my actions or thoughts since you seem to have a personal grudge towards me.

I am glad to see that you are of the opinion that new models run cool, since I have been telling you this for some time. You seem to have discovered in the course of the last hour that this is true of new Xbox 360s, not just PS3s.

Your intense angry attitude is out of line, and your constant recent criticism of the Xbox 360 of any vintage, no matter what more recent developments actually are, seems non-objective. Are you as unforgiving of your real-life friends' mistakes as you are to other mistakes made by humans you don't know personally?

-------

To all of us: There were already four posts about the PS3 cooling before I even commented, and since then we have hijacked this thread. When I find the time, I'd like to separate out the PS3 discussion from the themes and avatars discussion. Please let us try to post ontopic in this thread, and I'll try to move the PS3 posts to a new topic if the battery in the laptop holds out long enough. I disconnected from the power line because there is a lightning storm going on here right now, having arrived 3.5 hours earlier than predicted while I still had wet, clean, jeans hanging on the clothesline. I'll try to reduce the quote below even further.





You keep talking about research, news, etc. You have done this for purchasing your Xbox. I am telling you: what you are looking for for the PS3 is out there. Yet you have not done a single thing to look for it. Not a single thing.

The new PS3 slim is designed to run even cooler than the last few of the fat models. It generates less heat by using less power. It is a technical specification you can find posted on many gaming sites now.


I keep telling you this, that there are no significant hardware flaws on the PS3, but each time I read you talking about the PS3, I read "Oh there's this minor annoyance, oh the old models run pretty hot; so I might not buy one new model after all." You expect me to say: "That's very intelligent thinking." I am wasting my time telling you to go out and read, because you won't do it.

Old models run hot.
New models run cool.

Just like your new XBox model.

Look it up, or don't.

[Darkdrium777]

"I do not expect you to say anything positive about my actions or thoughts since you seem to have a personal grudge towards me."
No. Nothing of the likes. I've already said I hoped you enjoyed your Xbox somewhere else. What I am replying to is the fact that you are thinking there are heat issues for the PS3. I am trying to convince you that there isn't enough to be constantly worried about. Particularly with the newer models, which you seem to know so why post that you are worried?

"You seem to have discovered in the course of the last hour that this is true of new Xbox 360s, not just PS3s." I am not saying with:
"when you bought the very specific console known worldwide for systematic hardware failures due to overheating."
that all Xbox 360s run hot. What I said was: the Xbox 360 is known worldwide for the RRoD, which is a systematic hardware failure due to overheating. That's what it is, it's fact. I never talked about new or old models there. I know that the new models don't have this issue as much, though they still have issues as illustrated by this poll (http://consumerist.com/5338852/xbox-360-failure-rate-is-542-percent-game-informer-finds) (Which is most likely not representative.)

"Are you as unforgiving of your real-life friends' mistakes as you are to other mistakes made by humans you don't know personally?" I am unforgiving when faced with mis/disinformation, yes. I always say: if you don't know, don't talk. It's not 100% cut and dry of course, but the posts I've seen from you being constantly worried about the PS3 made me try to convince you that the situation is different. I don't know if it's personally that you thought it up, or if someone has been telling you this, but there isn't so much of a heat issue with the PS3 as there once was with the Xbox 360.

[Lance]

My 'worry' was about a buying a used old model, not a new one. Was that not clear? You seem so ready to jump on my comments particularly that it indicates you are still angry that I banned you for a week, though you were lucky enough that Foxxy did not agree with the ban, though I should have banned another 2 or 3 for inflammatory remarks made days before I was back on the forum again, in addition to you, which omission, of seeming unfairness, resulted in much angry criticism of me by you, and the whole sequence being played out in public.

But Re: the heating issue, it is something that has been so much discussed on the WZ that I naturally have some concern about the models mentioned as running hot, non-real-world sauna testing or not. I think I would be best off getting a new slim PS3 and should indeed probably stop considering the purchase of an older one as an economy. I am on a very limited income [the price I paid for a life of much freedom from the unpleasant], so it is more of a serious consideration than it seems to be for you, seeing as how you apparently have a fairly new four-core PC. I could not afford one of those, it is beyond my means, and I have house repair expenses to consider. So I am more intense about this issue as a practical matter in my hot weather circumstances, rather than giving a lot of value to lab tests, no matter how torturous. There are more kinds of realities in the 'equation' of value than lab results and tech specs. If I were to think that cell count is all important, and I had the cash to act on that, I might have a PS3 sitting in my house right now. Other concerns have resulted in that not being the case. I am being practical in my concerns; I would be a failure as a fanboy. As always we each rely on our own analysis of our personal needs, desires. Please stop trying so hard to convince me that your analysis of what's right and important should work for me. And stop calling me foolish or stupid when I don't agree with you.

[Darkdrium777]

resulted in much angry criticism of me by you, and the whole sequence being played out in public.Wait wait wait wuh?
I was angry, yes, that the other two or three people (Including Rob, for the same type of comment he made) weren't banned. That seemed quite unfair. A fair policy would have been to ban them all. So yeah I was kinda angry. Was also kinda angry because people kept bumping the stupid thing up and down when the issue was already solved (in other threads too). I said I didn't like it so much that you only banned me and not the others. I also said I didn't want an apology from you. I didn't criticize you as much as I could have though, or called you names, or whatever... Would you like to have another read? (http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6349&highlight=goodbye+thread+locked&page=2)
Besides, way to go for bringing in another topic again... >.< My PM box has 182 spots left.

I already explained why I was replying to you: I don't/didn't understand why it was such a concern/worry about every little thing that could possibly happen. That is why I was saying: look this doesn't happen as much, you shouldn't worry, etc. You're talking about financial issues, now that's an explanation.

And finally, I'm sorry.

[Frances_Penfold]

Lance, for what it's worth, my PS3 (a third gen unit with 80 gig hard-drive) runs cool as a cucumber and has had zero problems of any sort.

I kinda wish that electronics makers were required by law to report to report failure rates as a "consumers' rights" issue. It is hard to know what real world failure rates are.

BTW, Lance, do you have a PSP yet? One of the best values in gaming ATM :)

[AG-wolf]

"One of the best values in gaming ATM"

Provided it's a model before v3000 of course, for reasons we are not allowed to discuss lol

[Frances_Penfold]

To be clear, I'm not talking about piracy ;)

The PSP has a really deep library, including many titles that can be bought for $10-20 USD new, with expanding options for digital purchasing if you want to roll that way. The hardware itself runs $150, is very reliable, energy efficient, and can easily be hooked up to a home TV using a first-party peripheral. Plus there are lots of inexpensive add-ons like grips and cases.

It's a good time to be a hand-held gamer these days :)

[AG-wolf]

True enough... I dunno, my whole issue with the PSP is the same problem I've had with every hand-held console since the original GameBoy; I'm never "on the go" enough in situations that are actually suitable for playing a handheld game. On breaks/lunches at work, I use the time to eat my meal for whatever given time it is (my "lunch" at my most recent job was at 6:30pm, thus that was my dinner). If I have an appointment somewhere (doctor, dentist, etc), I get there just before the scheduled time so I'm not stuck waiting 45 minutes prior. If I have to go on a long trip (like leaving my house in northwest CT to get to Boston at 1:30am tonight to pick up my sister and brother in law, then driving an hour north of Portland Maine to bring them home, then sleeping and driving back home to CT tomorrow before Noon on saturday), I'm usually the person driving, so I can't really sit and play a game. When I was in school, there was never really adequate time to sit and play something... On top of that, I've only ever found a small handful of exclusive titles for any handheld that I really wanted to play, and I would just play them at home with an AC adapter plugged in the wall anyway :/

Given that Lance says he prefers practicality when it comes to gaming, even the "value" the PSP can offer may not apply. I bought a PSP at launch, and still to this day have only purchased two games for it (bet you can't guess which ones *cough* lol), other than that, I modded the crap out of it and loaded it with emulators and stuff... and still got bored with it. The "really deep library" doesn't seem to have anything to offer that I can't get on a main console like PS2/360/etc, and even its exclusives aren't anything more than another entry in a series that already exists on different machines. Not my thing I guess... hahaha well I guess that's one more thing I don't have to worry about packing up and bringing to college next week :P

[Lance]

I've come close to buying an old PSP a couple of times, but somehow I do not yet have one. I do not play games anywhere but home, so that aspect doesn't even come into consideration. I do have a DS because I wanted to try a couple of classic platformers to see if I like them, or at least why so many people do. SomehOw, I still have not got one of those platformers, but do have a couple of racing games, including NFS ProStreet which I find that I like much better on the DS than on the 360 because there is a quickrace mode and a track editor, neither feature being available on the 360 version. The portable is fun to just pick up and play.

----

There is more than economics to consider in buying anything. Tech for tech's sake or just wanting to have the thing with the highest specs so I can feel like I'm on the cutting edge doesn't play into my decisions either. This is one of the reasons I can always consider more than one machine for purchase and more importantly, use. It can certainly give one more options. Sometimes, with a little judicious use of available funds, one can acquire more than one console 'family', and pick the game versions one likes the best, and I never feel like I have to have only the one that is considered [by the majority, or somebody, or whatever] the most 'cool', most prestigious.

----

But to continue the discussion of PS3 heat, the 40 GB seems to be the one most often mentioned as cool running. I may not need any bigger harddrive than that, or might not need a harddrive at all considering my current lack of interest in online gaming. But if I got one, and given my past experience with a couple of HD failures, I'd probably want to go with a new one, which just adds to the reasons I already mentioned for probably preferring a new slim PS3 if I get a Sony machine. And I'm hoping Sony will be releasing games on hardcopy.

[okam]

I have the 40 GB model, and the only noise I ever hear from it is the little beep when you turn it on/off. No fan noise, or noise from the drive, at all.

For me, 40 GB is plenty, since I don't load it up with music or movies. You do need a HD though, as some games install data from the DVD/Blu-Ray onto the HD for faster loading times (there is no option of "would you like to install YES/NO, so there is no way around it), and you will probably want to download game updates or additional content which will also be stored on the HD.

Most PSN games that I have downloaded are less than 500 MB each, and DVD/Blu-Ray disc games rarely install more than 1 GB each (allthough Fallout 3 installed over 3 GB I think... ). I still have plenty of room for mp3s for my custom soundtracks, game screenshots that I have taken, etc.

That said, you can get cheap-ish 500 GB replacement HDs and they are apparently very easy to install (no need to open up the console, etc), so if you regret it later you can always do something about it.