****Very Important Rules and CHEATING ***

[TYSON]

Hi everyone,
As most of you are aware there are 'Cheats' or 'Codes' that have been included into the games for all the wipeouts. Wipeout 3 and SE stand out as the only in the series that benefit dramatically from using these codes.

The code know as "NOFEAR' enables a user to have unlimited thrust and unlimited shield. As an Expert Wipeout player, I have personally tested this code and have found that I can get a 16.64 using the Assegai at Porta Kora using this method. (Lap time.)

Some of the people in the records at the moment may be pissed off about me addressing this issue because they currently use the (SPECULATION ONLY - ABSOLUTLEY NOT BLAMING ANYONE) code but the very important point I would like to make is that wipeout is a game based on best times. If that means that the programers have included unlimited boost, then that's exactly what I expect everyone will do. I personally have no objections to everyone doing this AS LONG AS EVERYONE HAS THE ADVANTAGE.

I also believe by addressing this problem utilising this method instead of throwing it away, we will infact eradicate all cheaters completely because NO ONE will have the advantage.

This needs to addressed carefully, I know that people will have dramatically differnt views and I am writing this for a response from all members. Please voice your opinion.

[Task]

I myself never use "cheat codes", with the possible exception of WOXL animal ships.
I'd be quite surprised if anyone here did use them.
The reason they should not be used is that people who look at the times shouldn't have to assume any strange circumstances were required in order to achieve such a time. This means no cheat codes, no taking advantage of bugs in the game, no hacking, etc, etc.
Now I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that most everyone here knows this. This little community we've got here probably accounts for 82.7% of all the honor you can currently find online. I just assume that nobody who posts in this forum "cheats" on the time tables, and so far I've been correct. Not that I can really speak for the PAL tables, since I don't really look at them, but this should give you a good idea of what kind of a good thing we've got going here.
I really don't think we need a mass reply of everyone saying they'd never do any of the things you've suggested. Although this would be a good spot to hear from anyone who has found any codes to be of any use to them. I don't really expect any of those types of replies.
Now you're new here, so you're probably thinking "this guy is crazy, here we are, on the web, home of the largest group of losers to ever use their parents internet connection, and he's saying that everyone here is cool. No way." and I can't blame you.
Now I'm going to do something that will amaze you. I'm going to prove my claim.
Find yourself any one time on any of the WipeoutZone tables and post a question here in the forums about it. Make your question something along the lines of "how the...?!?" and ask how such a time is possible, was achieved, etc, etc.
And then magic will happen.
People will reply! Likely you'll get a solid reply from the pilot in question, and probably 5 or 6 other replies. The important thing will be the content of the replies. Absolutely 0 flames, and about 3 replies that are tips and techniques that you can use to not just match the time you're talking about, but beat it!

Go ahead, try it out. Be amazed!

[Lance]

.
using cheats would eliminate any sense of accomplishment for me. even if everyone were using them.

you will notice that you do not in fact see any laptimes near 16.64. and the pilots who are at the top of that phantom class in SE are very very good. if they used the NOFEAR cheat, their times would be radically lower. you would find this to be true in every class on every circuit in every version of the game that there are tables for. you will occasionally see an anomalous time where it is clear that the pilot made an accidental mistake during the entry of the time, but i've seen no clear evidence of cheating.

a few months ago, i paid a visit to the tables and saw a time that stunned me. it looked impossible. so i got serious about racing; and ended by beating that time by more than 3 seconds. too bad he came back and beat his old time by 4 and half seconds, but that's because he's a better pilot than i am, and has consistently proved to be somewhat superior on every course. but i can see places on the course where i am losing time because i am not doing it as perfectly as it could be done. i simply applaud the better pilot while bitching about my own imperfections.

this group is the most honourable bunch of racers i've ever seen. i'm proud to be here.

cheatcodes are for ''what-if?'' mucking around when you get bored, not for racing.

___lance
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[TYSON]

:)

Great to see some quick replies, I guess I should elaborate on some points, firstly I respect your opinion Lance on the subject of pilots already on the records list using the NOFEAR cheat would have much lower times. I must say I completly disagree with this, have you tried the NOFEAR cheat, basically unless your an expert pilot you cannot even keep up with the lower times on the table! The reason for this of course is that having unlimited thrust takes even Phantom to a new level (as you could imagine) and so is humanly impossible to contol at the best of times. My initial statement of 'huge advantage' may have been a little over the top (maybe not for Vector and Venom). But I would like to ask some of the pilots on the records if they will infact have a bit of a go and see what happens. Basically it is my belief that pilots on these records tables could be exploited and cheated of their rightful places and to make sure everyone is aware of the cheat is to erradicate it.
I think that point got lost somewhere.

Tyson

[Wiseman]

About the only cheatcodes I ever use are for the Animal Ships(for XL), like Task said, and also sometimes I put in the code that turns the turbos white (in Wipeout 3) along with the code that makes the ships react like the ones did in the original Wipeout when they hit the walls.

These 2, coupled together, make Wipeout 3 extremely difficult, but boy, it sure is fun.

But I don't ever use any of them when it comes to making times for the times tables.

Infox already has all of the rules set out for the times tables, and I have no intention whatsoever of breaking them.


But, you could always create a challenge in the arena forum if you were curious as to what other peoples times with cheats are, I mean, it would be your contest, so you can make pretty much any rules (or lack thereof) you want. Wouldn't say how many people would actually enter it, though. ;)

[infoxicated]

"The best way to stop cheating is to let everyone cheat"

I completely disagree with that!

We have only had one guy use that cheat - back in January, and he admitted to it straight away too. Cheats are automatically ashamed of themselves - they will very rarely show their faces in the forums and for the most part will just shove a quick time in the records table then watch the site from afar.

We all have an understanding of the desire to be genuine and truthful here on WipeoutZone. If anyone appears to be cheating, there is usually an explanation for it - wrong time in the wrong track - lap time for race time - that kind of thing.

Tyson - standard wipeoutzone rules apply to all times logged. All AI ships and weapons must be enabled.

[Lance]

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TYSON said:
''...on the subject of pilots already on the records list using the NOFEAR cheat would have much lower times. I must say I completly disagree with this, have you tried the NOFEAR cheat, basically unless your an expert pilot you cannot even keep up with the lower times on the table!''

my point was that the pilots at the top of the times tables tend to be experts.

i have tried that cheat to see what difference it makes. i used it in classes lower than phantom, and even though i am not at all in the expert group, i was able to cut my times substantially with very little practice. that's why it's called a cheat.

as George said, if you're curious to find out what times can be achieved by other pilots relative to your times using the cheat, post a challenge in the arena, stating the specific conditions. generally, it's probably better to keep the challenge from being too broad; to restrict it to one course and one or two classes. phantom is obviously the one you're interested in here. pick a course, set the conditions, and the date of closing; see what develops :)

it's been too long since a challenge was posted. largely due to the release of Fusion in north america. but it should not be a problem to find a few takers for PAL, though those pilots have been a bit quiet in WO3 since the release of Fusion earlier this year.
.

[jmoid]

hi tyson, thanks for your post. firstly, it's good to see that we have another person in our ranks that cares passionately about keeping the tables cheat-free. its great that so many people love this game as much as i do! secondly, i've been around this site quite a while, and i trust the times that are in the tables. lance and infox have provided examples of bogus times appearing in the tables, and in my experience these have always been weeded out. what normally happens when a specific time is called into question is that infox will email them and ask them for their comments, and if none are forthcoming the time is removed, or if it's a genuine (which does happen) then just like lance said, the person involved will go back and correct their time, and usually post a "sorry" here on the boards.

i wholeheartedly agree with task's comments about the nature of the community we have here - and i think the comments in this thread bear that out.

on the subject of cheats i use the animals cheat on xl/2097 too. i haven't actually tried NOFEAR, and to be honest i hadn't considered how it could be used to produce fake times, so thanks for raising the point :)

[TYSON]

:lol: Hi everyone again. I've been watching this forum carefully so that I may add to it to clear up any misconceptions I may have written.

Firstly what may not be clear is the fact that I am NOT advocating the use of cheats. I will carefully make the statement of "If everyone uses them no one will benefit" yes that may be true but it doesn’t make for good fun does it. (I totally agree with that). What I did not explain correctly was the fact that these cheats to my understanding cannot be officially tagged or in other words picked up by anything other than actually watching the person play. This presents a problem for not only your awesome charts Infox but also to “Twin Galaxies” whom are the official world record holders of video games. Some of you may already know about these guys, they’re basically the Guinness book of records for video games. You may well be asking yourself why the hell is Tyson talking about world records? Well the fact is I’ve owned Wipeout 3 Special Edition for 4 days now and WITHOUT any of the cheats activated just got a 1:41 in phantom at porta kora. I also believe that my times for wipeout 2097 are world record status and I’ll be contacting Twin Galaxies to officiate any such records. Thank you to the last comments made about my enthusiasm to protect those rightful places of record holders, finally someone understood what my subliminal message was. I am a record holder!

Tyson

[Vasudeva]

"I am a record holder!"

Welllll.... we'll see about that 8).

Peace,
V.

[Lance]

.
1:41? you might want to take a look at the current top time in the NTSC tables of wipeoutzone. it's a 1:35+
while there may be differences in the versions, the longer i have paid attention to the tables, the more it seems that they are very close to each other in potential times, so that when a race is contested with equal ferocity in different versions, the times are similar. i could be wrong of course, but it may take more work and a lower time to produce a world record that will hold up
.

[JABBERJAW]

1:31.1 for ntsc, 1:31.48 for pal 3se. Forgot for regular 3, maybe around 1:35. Se has some serious shortcuts in a couple of areas. I think sub 15 is possible with those codes on.

[Lance]

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i was going by this:
at 8:00 PM eastern standard time today, NTSC, Porto Kora, phantom class:
1: Al Sartwell,USA ,Icaras,1:35:77

are these 1:31.xx times only on your memory cards, Al? cmon, post em in the tables, don't hold back. :D
you should scare the rest of us with the 'rip the bandages off in one big go' technique.

[lance notices that he is so far behind in porto kora phantom, that it would be funny if it weren't painful ;) ]

.

[Asche XL]

I dont like trying to get best times in wipeout 3 because of the thrust.

The best game to go for lap times and race times is XL no boost or anything, just flat out speed racing.... If your doing fusion all special weapons should be turned off so you dont get a boost. See wit 3 it's hard because you have to calculate the right time to boost and to regain your boost and stuff. Too complicated, i think we should have a section for XL racing....in my opinion.

[AmishRobot]

I think Al was referring to time trial results.

Though I'm personally not a big fan of the hyperthrust, I think it does require a much greater degree of skill when it comes to times. Seperates the weenies from the hot dogs, so to speak. :)

[Wiseman]

Pssst, hey Lance....

::points in the general direction of the Time Trial tables::

:wink:

[TYSON]

:lol: Thanks Lance, I totally agree with your last comments there about the time not holding up. And yes I do attack the NTSC times list (I actually base my times on that) because I know that NTSCers have a few seconds advantage. I was just making a little point wth the 1:41, it wasn't supposed to be a WOW time. I was simply trying to backup my claims of ‘expertise' by showing I could get around the records in short time (I've had the game for less than a week). Zoolander mentioned a 1:31, which to me sounds more like it, however PAL players may be a bit troubled getting that exact figure.

Vasudeva, I'm not really sure why you decided to quote me there? I'm guessing just a friendly competitive note... lol

I agree with Asche XL who said that Wipeout XL is better to get times in due to the lack of thrusters but I enjoy the challenge of W 3 even though.

Hi there to Zoolander (Al Sartwell I’m assuming?). Yeah maybe a sub 15 for NTSC, when I got a 16 with assegai I was thinking the same thing, there are three shortcuts I’ve found. If you like you can write to me about them. The hardest thing is utilising the shortcuts to your advantage! It would be good to get into a talk about all the shortcuts.

Um I know this will sound weird after we've been talking about the records for a little while now. But Infox, where exactly are the rules posted? I've looked all through the site assuming that I would find them but still havn't. I mean, I can't even tell whether the times are for arcade (most likely) or whether they're time trial. It should be clear right? I'm only trying to make a contribution there, no intention to bag you out or anything.

I got a reply from a guy at Times Galaxies (Read earlier comments), he basically said due to the cheats and codes etc. that a video would have to capture any records from the start of turning on the console to completion of race! Can you imagine having to video all your records lol.

Keep flying!

Tyson
:D

[Sven]

I saw the rules when I first joined the tables. I'll restate them for you (anyone correct me if I'm wrong).

for single race times, no cheats may be used, it must be against a full field (11 opponents), and weapons must be on.
time trials are listed seperately and you may not use cheats.

That's basically it, I think.

Sure the hyperthrust complicates things, but you're not supposed to give up on something just because it's hard! :wink:

[Lance]

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James and G: i didn't even think about looking at the Time Trial section. i fear that this is a very common failing amongst we NTSCers ;)
when i first got into wipeout, i did post some times for that mode, but haven't done so for quite a while now.

TYSON: the rules are posted in the Arena forum. it's supposed to be a 'stickytopic' that remains at the top of the forum, but i don't think it currently does. i think it may have been posted before the new version of the boards program that allowed stickytopics was available.
Sven has it correct. For our official times tables, there are just the 2 basic modes of SingleRace and TimeTrial, nothing based on challenges or eliminations.
These two categories have separate listings, the times for one type may not be entered in the tables for the other.
For singlerace, all competitors and weapons must be enabled.
In both singlerace and timetrial, hyperthrust may be used, and any ship may be used.
No cheatcodes may be used in either of the competition modes.

as to challenges made in the Arena forum, you may set any conditions possible, but only the resulting times which meet all the TimesTables criteria may be entered there. the results of special Arena challenges are posted in the Arena forum.

i can't imagine nOt using a video to verify a time for official world records.

i love hyperthrust; when playing 2097, i feel the lack of that extra tactical and stategic dimension. 2097 is an excellent game, but hyperthrust is a big part of why i like WO3 better, it's just that much more complex and difficult to achieve the maximum possibility. this is probably why i've found wip3out to be more addictive than any other game i've played. though the ability to compete with other players through the medium of the wipeoutzone times tables is a big part of it, too
.

[Wiseman]

Um I know this will sound weird after we've been talking about the records for a little while now. But Infox, where exactly are the rules posted? I've looked all through the site assuming that I would find them but still havn't. I mean, I can't even tell whether the times are for arcade (most likely) or whether they're time trial. It should be clear right? I'm only trying to make a contribution there, no intention to bag you out or anything.The rules are listed at the top of the "Log in & Update" page.


Please use the links below to update your times for each track. All times should be based on WipeoutZone rules of racing against 12 opponents and weapons activated. Please do not enter fake times - a lot of members put a lot of hard work into achieving their records and it would be highly unfair to displace them with inaccurate information.

Please also make sure you are updating the records for the version(s) of the game that you own.

[Hybrid Divide]

I use cheat codes for fun. As in to see what happens and such.

But for beating games / getting fast times, practice is the only way to go.

Vagrant Logic OUT

[JABBERJAW]

The main shortcuts don't work as well or at all on ntsc. ON se they work incredible, on pal 3, only sometimes

[zargz]

well, thats y I dont like porto kora and manor top AND thruster(NOT thruster2097!!)

coz of the shortcuts, wich 4me R cheats. and the thrust just helps u make it thru them even better .. that's y I'm happy the dont have thrust in fusion!

@SE almost ALL the classic trax r ruined coz of the huge shortcuts on most of them.
my favorites and the ones I concentrate on r stanza inter, sampa run, hi fumi & terminal I think I'll give a go to mega mall also coz it seems to me like a 'nojump track' too ..
and G4V has eluded me long enuff with that venom sr time !!! :x

btw I despise the autopilot too! :evil:
no wonder some guys who played wo1 AFTER wo2097 and wo3 think wo1 is the most difficult! let me give u some hints - no autoilot .. practically nowhere to jump(cut) a corner .. no thrust to repare the damage after tuching a wall or help u over any corners! u c? :wink:

I dont mind a little cut of the track like for instance on turn3 @ PK u can fly just a bit over it, like 1ships width outside the track, b4 turn 4 leading 2the jump BUT when u fly thru bildings, signs bridges, mountain walls!! well ..

anyway I have to admit I DID use the short cut @PK vector se sr/tt and pal sr and I used the reason al gave me long time ago when we once in the beginnig of time disscussed the matter - 'everybody else does it so it's ok'. I still dont feel good about it but hey it nice to b 1st somewhere and 2nd after zool somewhere else! :D
it was a fun thing and I'm not even gonna try it at any higher class!! :oops:

everywhere else thou I stick 2the trax.

also IF the programmers of the games 2097/XL and 3/3se did make all the buildings, mountains ect solid AND made the wuzz wagons more alert when pilots getting oftrack then we wouldnt even have to think of it now would we? 8)

ahh! almost 4got!!

tyson: whats u name on the time tables? :wink:


as u were! zargz out ..

[Vasudeva]

I personally don't mind shortcuts and long jumps. It usually does take some ingenuity and skill not to mess the shortcut up, and slam against the wall in the next curve. All in all, it comes down to exploiting the games' weak spots, and I don't think that would count as cheating: in former case, you make use of what's already there without extra codes and other smart tricks, whereas in latter case something is "added".

My 2c :)

Peace,
V.

[zargz]

btw I dont belive there r ppl cheatin here .. :wink: