the best team on pure

[0llie]

what do you guys reckon the best team is on pure?

[Lance]

the one you like the best.

[Sausehuhn]

or the one you can race with best

[Lance]

the one i can race the best usually iS the one i like the best. :D

[Airrider]

Yeesh, this topic borders on being TOO objective...

[Lance]

au contraire, i am being entirely subjective. my favourite team is the one i can win with.

[infoxicated]

Sadly, I think it's probably the Puma team ships.

I always race with Icaras... which makes me think I'm playing with Lance's ship behind his back ;), but for me it's by far the best of the traditional teams in the game and means I don't have to use one of the commercially sponsored download ships to set good times.

I wish the AG Systems hadn't been shafted in the speed/shield department or I'd still use that. I think Colin wanted revenge on me for slagging off Harimau and hamstrung my AG Systems. ;)

[xEik]

Sigh, if only Rob had shut up. ;)

[Lion]

I don't know why it is, but the balance of icaras does not suit my capabilities, and I do a LOT better with AGS... especially on Vohl Square where I've even managed to beat Asayyeah and ElHabib on a couple of occasions.
The ship that poses me the most challenge when racing against skilled humans is triakis

as to the puma ships, as a 2097 Qirex fan I tried to love puma2.. but it just isn't the same... either that or I am just not very good with it. :p

[lunar]

Totally agree, Lion, a well flown Triakis is a huge problem in multiplayer (you know who I am talking about), because in any other ship you`re likely to run out of shield before the Triakis does. Triakis is also the fastest ship on some courses, I believe. Afaict, Puma 2 is just a slightly inferior Triakis, but still a good ship. Triakis is the best heavyweight, high speed/ low handling ship - faster and tougher than Icaras imo.

Puma 1 isn`t as good a middleweight as Assegai and Goteki, mainly because of the acceleration. Like Icaras, I think Puma 1`s stats flatter its real abilities - or maybe I just like to think so in Puma`s case! ;)

AGS and Van Uber are the best lightweights, and suit some people, but they will really get pummelled by a fast Triakis, far too often, and won`t set any lap records.

Take your pick, but overall, on balance, and all things considered, I reckon Triakis is the best ship, though this doesn`t mean it`s the best ship for every player, and it certainly can be beaten.

[Sausehuhn]

the one i can race the best usually iS the one i like the best. :D

yes, ok, then I understand your point^^
For me AG-5Y5 is defenitely the best looking ship in the game, with the 2. livery (and I don't use the 1st one anymore) it's THE WipEout ship for me when I'm talking about ship design.
But the ship I can race with best isn't AG-5Y5, so I make a difference between "like best" and "race best".
At the moment I'm racing with Triakis, it's the team I can race with best I think - it proofs one more time, that the stats don't tell you anything about how the ship is on the track (at 1st I didn't touch it because I thought I couldn't handle it - but at the moment I tried the craft it was the total opposite suddenly!)

Still hoping for a comeback of EG.r in the next WipEout.
And yes, in the Fusion style - it's one of these ships I really like in terms of design. Esspecially the 3rd one (the 4th isn't that good IMO).
And yes it would be fantastic if the guys from SL would send me a promo-disk with the game before release, so I could test if the new EG.r is a good succesor to the Fusion one in terms of design and handling of course ;)

[lunar]

Yes, Max, Triakis handling is surprisingly good - it can slice through corners while other ships, with better handling stats, are bobbing about and drifting like boats on a choppy sea. The ship I love is Qirex, but at the end of the day we play to win so it`s not an option for me.

[0llie]

your all stupid the best ship is triakis

[Lance]

.
you NEVER call anybody on this board stupid. do it again and you are gone.
.

[Sausehuhn]

We're stupid because we can fly with other ships good as well?!

With 14 you should be old enough to know what you're writing (and if not, take a look at a dictionary). Now, who's really stupid here?

:brickwall

[Lance]

.
''Now, who's really stupid here?''

Max, what did i just say to Ollie?
.

[Sausehuhn]

Sorry Lance, I'm just angry about the way 0llie is posting here. To me it sounds very uninteretsed and unkindly.
Sorry, but this had to be said.

PS: I did not see your post because in the time you were posting I was still writing... doesn't change the situation though.

[fusionfrenzy]

*Sidesteps akwards situation*

In Phantom I prefer the Assegai over the Triakis; the way it (the assegai) sweeps in and out of tight corners and regains speed instantly, it makes the Triakis feel lumbering and heavy in comparison.

Still, nothing will get me out of my Gotekki

[Lion]

Goteki's thrust is awesome, but I find it a little too twitchy and tend to oversteer constantly
every time I use G45 I get the feeling that if I could just control it properly (if I could use analogue well it might seem better) it would be the quickest ship in the game

[lunar]

I like Goteki because it`s so bouncy and floaty. Flying it feels really on the edge at times, like a real old AG ship, and you can have some spectacular crashes and disasters in it at Phantom. It`s very similar to Assegai. Assegai has sharper handling and slightly better thrust out of corners, Goteki has a bigger shield and maybe a little more straight line speed. The only drawback In G45 for me is that you have to watch out for drifting too much on corners, due to its floaty character, but it`s definitely amongst the best 3 or 4 ships, imo.

[Sausehuhn]

...and the 1st livery is visible on all ships...

[fusionfrenzy]

I agree lunar, the Goteki has a buoyancy and floatiness about it, especially in Phantom. I love taking it through the Delta league, the track design seems to suit it, especially as I use the analog nub now instead of the d-pad. But I have to use the Assegai on Beta, it's just light and swish enough for a certain track.

[username]

in my opinion (including the downloaded content) icaras is very good and a faivorite at the moment (as you can tell by my image) but i am rather asshamed to say that puma 2 (the twin hull one) is also a rather treat to fly (not to look at, mind you the shape is very much like wo3's qirex wich i like. once again, a shame about the paintwork!

[fusionfrenzy]

I can't see the appeal of the new Icaras right now. I just played an ascension rapier tournament with it and it's not a patch on the Goteki/Harimau/Assegai. The handling is too stern and it doesnt seem that floaty.

[JABBERJAW]

The question needs to be answered as to which one IS the best, not which one do you fly best(otherwise people would say feisar is the best in XL). Obviously, the test would only be applicable in time trial in that weapons are random for single race. Finding your best lap for each ship is the only answer(maybe race 100 laps with each ship, one turbo per lap). Eventually you'll get a great lap and then you can compare. Yes I know it's not a perfect solution, but there is no gameshark or codes for automatic pilot always on for all the ships(which might not work anyways).

[lunar]

You`re right there has to be an actual fastest ship for each track - but finding it would be such a tough mission! In Pure there could be a difference between "best" and "fastest". What is a great ship for 1 lap TTs might not be so good for 5 lap TTs or multiplayer. So it would be very difficult to do, and I really don`t think there is one ship which is the fastest on every track, but the nearest thing we have to such a scientific way to find out which is the fastest, at phantom anyway, are the times on the ghost site, which are done over thousands of laps between them, and are pretty close to minimum times, I think, in some cases. I wonder if anyone could beat all these times with zone or medievil, which in the past were said to be the quickest. I very much doubt they could. Triakis Takeover!:o

[JABBERJAW]

Where is the ghost site?

[G0rT]

The fastest ship IS Triakis, I know that for a fact. Although its speed only says 4 it cruises at a high speed and can maintain that high speed even through tough corners. Other ships that have 5 like Zone or Icaras are too light and they swing out and slow down through the corners. So in my opinion Triakis is the fastest, though I wish it weren't.

[JABBERJAW]

Now I might have to prove that wrong, but I have to finish the euro version first

[Piranha5p33d5]

I'm at my absolute best with Piranha Advancements. I also love their history and craftsmanship to boot ;)

The perfect match!

[fusionfrenzy]

No Pirhana craft will ever beat Wipeout 3's craft. I even still spell it wrongly, Wo3-style. It was just the perfect balance of speed and handling.

[Lion]

I'd say the 2097/xl version could beat it ;)

[fusionfrenzy]

Yes, well- that was only a prototype. I'm talking the real deal. That, and I got into Wipeout at Wo3 :)

[eLhabib]

Studio Liverpool, if you read this, this forum thread is the undeniable proof that you did an AMAZING job in balancing the ships in purE! there obviously is no superior craft, and that's exactly the way it should be! :clap

[Lion]

fusionfrenzy: noone builds a piranha like the chinese ;)

[lunar]

My prediction is that in the long run, once we have Pure tables, they will be so close at the top that anyone who wants a first place at Phantom will mostly need to use Triakis, due to its tremendous ability to truck through corners without losing speed. I am of course ready and willing to be proved wrong, (Al) ;) I wonder if this handling feature was an accident, or put in deliberately by SL? Whatever, they still did a fantastic job of balancing the ships, and the difference isn`t much, much less than a second per lap between Triakis and most other ships, and in multiplayer there`s not necessarily any reason for anyone to abandon their favourite ship for the big Triakis. :)

[miufs]

I usually play with the Harimau craft. I just love its design and its very fast with good handling. All this has price, a very very poor shield. =)
Qirex is awesome cause its a very well balanced ship.
In terms of handling nothing beats the Feisar ship, but its to slow despite having an awesome thrust. =)

[JABBERJAW]

Iv'e finally played for a while now on vineta, and all I have to say is triakis Should not be the fastest ship for time trial at least. triakis has a 4-2-2-5. Some other ships have 4-3-3-4 and are not as fast. The shield strength does not come into play on vineta tt. Hell, piranha should smoke it with a 5-2-2-2(or something like that) just due to it's speed and equal acceleration. The same number of barrel rolls are achieveable, not to mention Icarus. I do like how the ship feels, but all I am saying is that these ships are not balanced due to their specs, hell, the daxenator is just as fast as icarus with 3 speed on an easy track.

[Omni Requiem]

I guess the Icaras is definitely my favourite, good speed, thrust and a pink paint-job always gets me going. Also, if it weren't for the harsh branding on the Puma 1 ship, it would come a joint first, Puma 1 has a decent design, paint-job and stats so it's my second craft.

[lunar]

I found this quote in an old interview with Colin Berry:

"All the ships have been created in a way so that they all have pros and cons. We've balanced the stats so that no one ship becomes redundant and no one ship is easily the best to use on every track. We do not want the player to feel that they have to use a certain ship to win a certain race."

I think they did a bloody good job of trying to achieve that, but ultimately Triakis (at least at Rapier and Phantom class) has defied their efforts. It`s never too late to change things though, and make the balance how it was meant to be: maybe there could be one last download pack with four upgraded ships capable of giving Triakis some headaches and knocking it off some of the Phantom lap records......

Triakis is the best at Phantom and Rapier for so many reasons:

- Practically the fastest ship on straights. A couple of ships are very marginally faster, but Triakis` weight means it doesn`t bob and rock around much, so in practice it often is the fastest on a straight line.
- It`s the fastest around most types of corners.
- It has more shield than any other ship so it can barrel roll more. I guess it was given the big shield to compensate for being apparently slow. Maybe it wasn`t tested well enough to see how good it really is overall.

Apart from speed in TTs and races, it has other advantages for a race-only situation:

- It shrugs off some weapon fire that would leave any other ship struggling or even coming to a halt.
- It can ram other ships clear off the track, or just push them aside in a tight spot, and it is not as badly affected by being rammed itself.
- I suspect that some ships are slowed down less by hitting walls. I think heavier ships, with strong shields, don`t suffer as much from wall hits as light ships.


There may be more, but all this makes Triakis the top ship. I`m not suggesting there`s anything wrong with using it; it doesn`t make sense not to in some ways, but it would be so great if the balance the ships were meant to have could be put back in through the release of some new ships. Triakis is going to dominate the Phantom tables, and dominate in multiplayer, so how about an upgrade for some of the ships that are classic names, but which were hard done by in the original UMD content of the game: a Mk2 for AGS, with the straight line speed to scare Triakis, and Mk2 ship upgrades for Qirex, Auricom and Piranha too: all with big, but well-judged stat-boosts to make them rival Triakis on some courses. Now all that would be a real treat, make playing the game very interesting indeed, and extend the life of the game even further.

I know it`s hardly likely to happen...... but I guess it is technically possible.

[JABBERJAW]

there is no weight in the game for the ships, colin berry I believe said this. Can anyone verify this

[eLhabib]

he did say that, yes. however, there IS something LIKE weight in the game, seeing as my feeble Assegai slows down drastically if I only release the gas pedal ever so slightly, but the heavy Triakis keeps on going for MUCH longer and reduces speed only slowly. Also with weapon hits you can see that clearly - a rocket can ruin my day completely in an Assegai, but a Triakis will shrug it off with almost no speed loss, as long as he doesn't slide into a wall. And let me tell you, in a race with 3 Triakis (Arnaud, Stin, Sleh) you get bullied around A LOT if you don't manage to break away right at the start in an Assegai!

as for Lunar's idea - it's never gonna happen, bro, but boy would I love an upgraded Assegai ;)

[Lion]

<troll> so essentially what lunar is saying, is that 0llie was right after all ;) </troll>

[lunar]

Yes ;) And dreaming of a new rival to Triakis.

[Smoothly Does It]

For what it's worth, when I picked up pure again just the other day, I switched to Auricom and it's working for me ATM, couldn't hack the Triakis, got sick of being pwned in the AG-5Y5 & even with pure's mind numbingly tedious acceleration, I find it (Auricom) to be almost pretty good. /me is a gob:turd

[Asayyeah]

Yes ;) And dreaming of a new rival to Triakis.

Triakis is the supership and a new real rival for it, should be good for all of us.
It reminds me something : The Fish theory :o
a new ship has been released on 2097 : Piranha the supership ( no contest on that : except for talon's reach venom TT with the bullet brick / thx to Ben ;) / )and it was a fish.
Now on pure at the start many people thought the best ship was zone due to his speed hability, but we prooved it wasn't this one due to low shield and light weight. It's triakis, imo and this a new team and a fish too( also called leopard shark).

[Lion]

(also called leopard shark).the official ship of Steve Zissou!

[eLhabib]

well ACTUALLY, the triakis logo is supposed to be a BOMB, not a fish...

[Lion]

I tried pointing that out once before and just got looked at funny
it's easy to see in that animated image where there's about 4 layers of them falling

[Asayyeah]

@ Leon : i haven't seen yet this film with Bill murray aka steve zissou.
Triakis should be the ship for a futuristic captain nemo ( 20000 feet above the see and not 20000 Leagues Under the Sea :cowboy )

@ Martin : yeah Triakis is da-BOMB baby :D