What`s a shortcut in Spilskinanke and what isn`t?

[G'Kyl]

After feeling somewhat satisfied about my times in Talon`s Reach I decided to move to another Spilsk. (that being my favourite track might have helped make the decision a little easier :) ). Only I ran into some difficulties figuring out what I were supposed to consider a regular jump over the platforms and what would be an "illegeal" shortcut. I tend to think that I don`t have to take the long road only to cover "all the track there is" if the exit of one of these platforms faces the middle of another. Or do I? Is there any consensus about this in the forums or does everybody has to figure out how far her/his morality goes by themselves? :)

Ben

[Lance]

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i don't think that Spilskinanke shortcuts have even been discussed in the forums. i've not driven it much, but so far, i don't use any shortcuts. i'm sure it will be quite heavily discussed when Arnaud publishes the ones he's found. doesn't help you much at this instant, though, does it? :)
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[yuusen]

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in regards to the question of morality (some keen observers will notice a mild hypocricy in what i am about to say), just throw it out the window. many people on the forums (including myself) dont see anything outside entering codes as 'wrong'. on a personal opinion, beating a game means beating the developers code, in whatever for it takes. i think someones already said that but it is worth echoing.

hope it helps.
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i was going to say something more specific i.e. regarding the jumps but on reading your post you seem to be aware of it anyhow.
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¥

[Asayyeah]

http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1286

At the end of my first post you have the description of Spyl, but to answer you G'Kyl concerning illegal way or not it's you to choose how d'ya wanna play, just to add that if i thought shorcuts could be 'illegals' i will have been deleted all of my scores but i don't do that( even only few shorcuts might be possible with pirahna only in phanthom)
For Spyl shorcuts i use only the last one ( to avoid the last fracture of the track in crossing the wall before), :oops: i ve forgotten the little one ( cross a wall around the 'C' section to enter properly in the big tunnel in a quite straight line.
Here's my position.

[G'Kyl]

Lance: Nope, not really. ;-))

yuuusen: For me the thing is that I have immensly more fun when driving the game as if I were really there, which of course includes to not cross walls and ceilings. :) Also, I don`t think it`s much fun to go searching for shortcuts, and to be later beaten by another player just because she/he used another one I hadn`t found yet.
Bottom line is: I believe the tables are MUCH more competetive when all contenders use the same racing line.

Asayyeah: Good thing the Piranha is unable to go through most of the shortcuts. ;-) Well, I think I`ll be handling it this way: I will jump over one or two of the side walls, because as far as I am concerned not doing so would contradict any sense of a sensible racing line. No walls, no ceilings, though. :)

Ben

EDIT: my first, disappointing times for the track at Rapier: 2:20.0 - 0:31.8 (and 2:17.9 - 0:31.5 just before I went to work).

[rejj]

I think that reading this post in the wip3out forum (http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=871) would be a good idea.
(don't be put off by the first few posts only being about turbo scrapes.. the thread is relevant to this sort of discussion in general)

[G'Kyl]

Thanks reji. In fact I've read all that thread several weeks ago. Seems to me the only conclusion is for everyone to make up their own mind as to where you wanna stand when they point a gun at your AG racer and ask you how you just did that. *g*
Ah, back to the subject. I'm still a little lost here, but yes, I do fly over a few walls. And yes, I am convinced that's the very idea of flying at Spilskinanke. :)

Ben

[Jetlag]

Surely anything that the game will let you get away with is classed as legal!

[G'Kyl]

Not quite. Although there's the occasional discussion about legal and illegal shortcuts, or shortcuts in general for that matter, flying through solid obstacles will surely be qualified as "illegal" by most pilots, even though the game does let you get away with it. That's the problem really as far as I understand it: Wipeout (any Wipeout until 3SE) lets you do things which are clearly not in accordance to the intention of the developers, yet still they are possible. So basically it comes down to the question of whether or not it is correct to exploit what could be called a bug, or at least a shortcoming, of the game engine (due to technical limitations of the PSX, I assume). Personally I say: No, it's not. :) Simply because it destroys the illusion of reality within the game.

Ben

[Dimension]

I personally would class only shortcuts that end in you flying through buildings or other obstacles as illegal shortcuts, then aain there aren't really that many shortcuts in w3o for me to comment on this :P

[zargz]

Wipeout (any Wipeout until 3SE) lets you do things which are clearly not in accordance to the intention of the developers, yet still they are possible.
Ben Not in wipEout" (wo1)! >> no shortcuts there!! :D
+ no auto-coward + no hyperthrust + best tracks and tunes = best wo yet! >> pure might be the one to change my mind!
I know some some awsome 2097 & 3/se wipers that didnt complete wo1 yet! 8O
that's how good/hard it is!
*takes a long look in direction of the UK ;)

Preaterea censeo autopilotum esse delandam

[Dimension]

I haven't finished wipeout 1 yet, but then again last time I played it I was in high school lol

[G'Kyl]

Wipeout (any Wipeout until 3SE) lets you do things which are clearly not in accordance to the intention of the developers, yet still they are possible.
Ben Not in wipEout"

Oh, but there are shortcuts in WO! Plus, you can go through the buildings and ad tables. :)


+ best tracks and tunes = best wo yet!

Agree on the first one, disagree on the second. ;) I happen to have played WO for a few minutes only today, and the music certainly is the most coherent, most original, most "wipeout" of the entire series. The rest of the (Playstation) games has great licensed music, but it's way inferior to the atmosphere and adrenalin Tim created for the series' introduction. Unfortuanately, the 2097 PC soundtrack isn't quite up on the same level, mostly because it tries too hard to sound like it's PSX counterpart. My second favourite would therefore be the music from WO64. It's very original and very forward-going and consits of fewer licensed pieces. Yes, I guess I am not THAT extatic about a compilation of music whose parts already existed before the game.

Ben

[lunar]

Surely anything that the game will let you get away with is classed as legal!

spot on.....

Unless you`re competing in a specific challenge with stick2trax rules.

For times entered on the WZ tables, which are world records, the only enforceable rules are the ones written on the enter-times page. In this case it makes no sense to declare something illegal if the law is impossible to enforce, and only serves to make matters less certain.

but this road is well-travelled. :wink:

[Asayyeah]

Hum it seems the debate about shorcuts is not finished yet.

Thx Stephen to precise the rules & for support too :wink:

[Lance]

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it is good to see you here again, my friend. i've read your PM to me and will answer, but there is a great deal to comment on. so it will take a while and probably far more than one PM in response
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[lunar]

hey Arnaud...

I`m crap at shortcuts - Zargz is better than me and he hates them - but I think its the most logical position on the issue. Even so I hope there aren`t shortcuts in Pure.

hope all`s well in Le Havre :wink:

[zargz]

then read the pm i sent you >> you might see a shortcut i use .. :oops:
.. the only one .. :roll:

:P


Preaterea censeo autopilotum esse delandam

[Dimension]

Out of curiosity (and I don't know how much this happens in 2097,) what abut those times when you hit the edge of a corner and fly through it, that is effectively flying through a solid object and is illegal if flying through buildings are, right? Examples can be seen on the entrance/exit of the megamall pit when you hit it at the right angle, with enough speed and Hi Fumii when you hit the exit at a high enough speed. Please advise, cheers :)

[G'Kyl]

What you describe has probably more to do with the crafts ability to scrape over walls than a bug. I know which corners you mean, and it seems unlikely you can fly over them so easily, but as far as I know and have tried (Hi-Fumii mostly) you get quickly caught in the wall if you REALLY try to go through it, so there is certainly more skill than bug involved there. :)

Ben

[Dimension]

weeell, just thought i'd bring it up; hope nobody else sees it as a problem, my Phantom Mega Mall time would go straight out of the window if they did lol, nearly every time I end up cutting through one or the other of those walls :)

[Lance]

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i have a greAt idea! infox will just LOVE it! we can have TWO complete sets of records tables, one for stick-to-tracks, and one regular!

i hope infox is not a firearms enthusiast. [turns off lights and crawls behind couch]
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[G'Kyl]

LOL! Well, I'm all in for that. And doesn't Rob forget to give us seperate tables for Piranha and other ships, or else... ;)

[lunar]

Really there ought to be seperate table for negcon, d-pad and stick users, too. :wink:

[Lance]

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[envisions pigs flying in a frozen hell.]
.........
naah
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[Rapier Racer]

lol

that would way to many tables wouldnt it?