I am impressed with fusion...wipeout 3 sux!

[LeadeR]

Just gotta say,wipeout fusion is the best of the wipeout series...my personal opinion. i bought it yesterday and im almost done with the arcade mode.before i got the game i read in the forums that the game was full of bugs, so i was a little bit sceptic(do i spell this right?) before i tried it...but i was really impressed,this is the best racing sim ever,with wipeout 2097 on second place. i read on the forums that many of you are into wipeout 3, my opinion is that wipeout 3 is the worst of them all, it really sux.can anyone of u tell me whats so good about wipeout 3? i have the game but hasnt almost played it cause i dont like it...

[brokenvoice]

riiiiiight

[BenjaminSoulé]

If you didn`t played wo3 how could you say Fusion is better :razz:
I played a lot with all the Wipeout and I prefer WO3. I suppose we all have our own vision of Wipeout areas of interest. When develloper increase or decrease each of this aspects they make us happy or unhappy as well...

[LeadeR]

benjamin.... said: If you didn`t played wo3 how could you say Fusion is better.

i didnt post that i have not played wipeout 3, i have played it(read my post again benjy!)!

[Task]

WO3 does NOT suck!
It's high-resolution, there's no boost (many see that as a negative, I find it much more realistic and an interesting improvement), there are twice as many teams as usual, each track is unique, there are four (4!) bonus tracks, it's timed to the _millisecond_, the challenges are _great_, and you can play it for days and days without totally finishing the game.
Now, if you say you don't like the atmosphere, or the music, or the look of it, then I can see where you're coming from and I certainly can't argue with you. WOXL and WO3 may be in the same genre, but besides that they're totally different in _style_. Perhaps you don't like that style.
However, the game, the game _itself_, does _not_ suck. In no way, shape, or form.

And that's _my_ opinion. 8 D

[Lance]

i've not played fusion yet, but i have some experience of the other three. WO3 seems to me to be the best even though i like all of them. the precision of control, the more believable graphics [and the really cool UNbelievable graphics of the four bonus prototype tracks], the greater number of teams, the greater difference of feel between each of teams' racers, the great music, the difficulty and interest of the tracks, the lack of bugs, the sheer completeness of the game...., all of this just adds up to the best of the pre-Fusion series. it also seems to have a greater ''internal logic'', a consistency with its own physics model and racing type [pure circuit] than Fusion does.

[LeadeR]

Task wrote : WOXL and WO3 may be in the same genre, but besides that they're totally different in _style_. Perhaps you don't like that style.


woxl(2097), i love it! its great! i think its the best of the pre fusion series.i dont know why i didnt like wo3 that much,but maybe its because i suck at it, i think its the hardest of the games, maybe i should try playing it more...but i dont like the atmosphere of the game. the graphics are very smooth though..when it comes to wipeout 2097, i am very good at playing it, played trought the fastest class, but wipeout 3 rapier class, thats a tough one! havent played it that much though, it didnt give methe "little kick inside" that 2097 and fusion does.but hey,we are all different:)

[LeadeR]

Task wrote : there's no boost (many see that as a negative.....

do u mean the boost at the start? in that case there are.but its easier with a dual shock controller(when the controller starts to vibrate, when u give thrust, keep it in the "vibrating area" until "go" and u get the boost! if that was what u meant though...

[BenjaminSoulé]

I think that Task talked about the hyperthrust.
Boost as a bonus is unfair for making goodtime because its random.

For your post I was meaning that maybe you dont play enough to Wo3 but I`m not very good in english and sometimes i make mistakes :smile:

For 2097 / wo3 difficulty, there`s not much differents in my opinion, our opinion of game difficulty is affected by time we spend on it.
I mean the first time i opened Rapier mode in WO1 I was certain that it was a kind of bonus non-playable mode, and I stopped to play Wo1.
While I was playing to 2097 and wip3out I was still convinced that wipeout one was the most difficult because i didn`t even try to play it again... :smile:

Try a little harder on Wo3 this game is fabulous. By not doing so you miss as much as I missed while not playing to Wo1 rapier mode.

[Wiseman]

From my personal tastes, I think that the original Wipeout had the best track design, Wipeout XL/2097 had the best style/graphic design, and Wip3out had the best ships(and those wonderful prototypes).

If someone ever asked me straight up which one I liked best, I wouldn't be able to answer because I liked them all for different reasons.

If someone could just take the track design style of Wipeout, the graphic design of Wipeout XL/2097, and the ships from Wip3out, then my fav. Wipeout game would be born. :evil

As for the music side, I liked them all, they all had different styles which I thought was good and fit that praticular Wipeout well.

[AmishRobot]

When I first bought WO3 I hated it. In fact I got rid of it soon after. Of course, I need the full collection, :smile: so I bought it again a few months ago, and I've really warmed up to it. It does play very well.

I don't like the graphic style or the music as much as the previous two, but that's really all just aesthetics and comes down to personal preference. (except I think most can agree the font isn't well suited to a television display)

The only real faults I can find in the gameplay are the hyperthrust (I hate having to watch and nurture my shield strength for more speed - it becomes less of a thrill and more of an annoyance) and certain sections of track, such as all of P Mar.

And for the record, I get a lot more glitches and bugs in WO3 than WOXL.

WOXL remains my favorite (I'll wait to pass judgement on Fusion), but give WO3 another shot. It's not so bad.

[Confusion]

WO3 is so good I bought it twice (I'm gonna keep this one in mint condition so as to be able to play it 30 years down the line)!

WO3SE is even better though I doubt you can find it anyway now. Like a refined WO3.

WO2097 for me isn't as good as WO3. If it had analogue control maybe I would have a better opinion... but it still seems to be missing something which I can't quite put my finger on. Still... it was my first taste of wipeout so i can't fault it. :smile:

[LeadeR]

confusion: i bought wipeout 2097 twice, now i dont have(sold it some years ago with my ps1) it and cant find it in shops anywhere :sad:

the last track on the original wipeout is soooo much harder than the others....

[Confusion]

Wipeout 1 does look harder... some of the tracks taht were ported over to WO3SE like Arridos VII were too bloody hard!

[xEik]

The hardest WipEout track ever is LS4 Prototype at Phantom in WO3. Compared to this, Silverstream is just a piece of cake.
I still haven't played Fusion though. :cry:

[Lance]

the circuits in WO1 look to me a lot like present-day highways meant for cars, except for the jumps. maybe this is why some pilots favour them, because it's like driving a vehicle of the future on something we're familiar with.

[AmishRobot]

Confusion: WOXL does have analoge control, and so does WO1. You just need an NeGcon. :smile:

[science]

the in-game graphics, playability, and skill involved are what make WO3 such a great game, despite that everything else about it is pretty mediocre by the wipeout series standards.
btw, once you get the hang of it, hyperthrust adds a whole new dimension of skill to trying to reach record times. i will miss it sorely, assuming fusion ever makes its way to my neck of the woods...

[Lance]

i agree with joel about hyperthrust. the fact that it's limited plus the high level of its effectiveness adds a great level of tactics to the game. the more elements there are to balance against each other in a game, the more interesting it can be. combining with the random weapon pickups gives a continual set of choices to make in WO3 and makes every race a real challenge to doing your best, to achieving the fastest times.

using all the shield energy that you can before the end of the race leaves you on pins and needles hoping to make it to the finish line without touching a wall or being hit by a lapped competitor. one hit on the weak shields and you're gone just as you thought you were going to get a time a whole half a second ahead of your times tables nemesis. oh, the adrenaline rush of hyperthrust!

[science]

the challenge of coming up with really great times would be even more intense if you could take yourself down to say, 1% energy with hyperthrust. the pits would have to be more effecient, i.e. youd pick up more shield as you went through them. that would make for overall faster race times and exponentially more difficult races, as the laps would be faster overall, and significantly more dangerous!

[Lance]

i dunno. the extra shield energy from the pits would certainly make the laps faster, but it would also make it more likely that you would survive a mistake till the absolute last bit of the course. i'd like to try it though.

[Farsight]

I think Wipeout Fusion Sux! They 'Air-Brake' feeling is destroyed, the soundtrack is almost terrible and you can not fly anymore over the tracks. It's the nightmare I think. But WO3 and 2097 are perfect. I personally prefer 2097 because of the style and the soundtrack. (And of the Piranha with the perfect abilities, of course!!) Icaras is also fast and has a good handling but not so strong shields.. But it's really matter of taste!

[AmishRobot]

Boy, talk about digging up an old topic!

Welcome to Wipeoutzone. Dig a little deeper, and I think you'll find your views are widely held.

[Yuret]

Personally I think wip3out is a better game than fusion though i think the airbrakes are much better on fusion cos they dont slide you into a wall when you use them unlike in wip3out. Also wip3out feels "finished" whilst fusion is just full of bugs which ruin the game for me.

[Farsight]

Exactly! That's the point! The feeling is gone and it's like a bad car racing simulator..

[djb]

[quote="Farsight"]I think Wipeout Fusion Sux! They 'Air-Brake' feeling is destroyed, the soundtrack is almost terrible and you can not fly anymore over the tracks. It's the nightmare I think. But WO3 and 2097 are perfect.


yep, ive tried very, very hard to like fusion, and we all have our own opinions as to what is wrong with it, i could list these things here, but as previously pointed out, its all been said before. suffice it to say, that since giving my ps2 to my mum (to use as a dvd player), ive been twice as happy with my old ps1, and all my old wipeout games, it almost makes me want to cry with joy!!! knowing that no matter what sony does to mess up future wipeouts, i will always have these old games, ahhh they dont make them like they used to!!

[Lance]

.
i love my PSX games. purely as games and entertainment, they are the equal of anything requiring later generation consoles. not that i don't love my Dreamcast!
.

[zargz]

so u 'poor man' finally scrubed enogh 4a dreancast? :D

[Vasudeva]

Don't mess with Dreamcast owners Zargz.

:lol:

V.

[Lance]

.
i bought it shortly after i got my PSX, just over 3 years ago. they were still being made then. sigh. i paid 200 U.S. dollars for a new one, which was a bargain at the time. i've never regretted buying the Dreamcast
.

[DJ Techno]

I'm a fan of each and every Wipeout made, no matter what people think...

[rjsec4ever]

I am a fan of Sony and Sega myself too, but Nintendo could go away for an instance!

From playing cards to games, what the?

For some time, I used to mock Sonic. I really never knew why I mocked him. Maybe I just liked to run a lot when I was younger. lol. :P

Crash is sorta like my character though. In rare occasions, I like to be crazy and strange, like when it comes to parties for example.

Nintendo could just go away, I hate seeing its commercials! I Hate Nintendo. Period.

Nintendo makes GBA SP... wow, a 32-bit GAME GEAR (the lumious screen).

*"HAHA" to Nintendo*

[Vasudeva]

Yes, Sega were the true pioneers! Too bad for them they had horrible marketing advisers.

V.

[Lance]

.
advisors?
Sega had 2 problems: their chief operating officer during the Saturn era, and Sony's ability to sell at a loss. after a long series of poor judgement calls by that officer, he was fired by being promoted out of his office. following this, the chairman of the board decided to run the company himself. as a matter of honour and also feeling a debt to Sega customers, he tried to do it the right way this time, and succeeded in every way but one by building the Dreamcast. at that point, the previous COO's mistakes and Sony's exploitation of those had left SEGA in major debt, so they couldn't afford to add DVD play to the machine. this, combined with Sony's huge cash reserves due to their other businesses, allowed for the defeat of SEGA, despite their having the best game console of its time [which was not only powerful, but was also easy to program] and good games to go with it. too many people sat on their hands waiting for the release of the PS2 with its promise of a DVD player and game console all in one, and with the expectation that there would be some sort of 'magic of similarity' which would make it a repeat of the success of the original Playstation. and Sony could take the losses of selling consoles for less than they cost to make. at the end, SEGA was one and a half billion U.S. dollars in debt. with honour satisfied and certain financial disaster ahead, the chairman called an end to console production

a sad story. and of a type often repeated in the business world
.

[G-Hob]

The hardest WipEout track ever is LS4 Prototype at Phantom in WO3. Compared to this, Silverstream is just a piece of cake.
I still haven't played Fusion though. :cry:


Agreed! It took me close to 1,000 attempts to get a gold medal.

[AmishRobot]

Lance: While what you said did have a major impact on Dreamcast's demise, I wouldn't underestimate the incompetence of Sega's marketing staff. They blew the majority of their marketing budget (which was pretty big) on a short-lived series of tv commercials that made little sense and showed very little game footage. There was hardly any money left for any other type of advertising or promotion.

A good example is Space Channel 5. That was a fun game, if a bit shallow. That's the type of game that holds a really strong appeal for females. Non-violent, colorful, fun atmosphere, and easy to get into. That game could have been cross-marketed to great effect, but instead Sega chose to run a few really expensive commercials on male-dominated MTV, and a few ads in male-dominated gaming mags, assuming that all the 'hardcore gamerz' would go buy it, simply because it was quirky. They limited the potential of that game horrendously.

Now imagine some of the things they could have done with the money they blew on those commercials. The first thing is to advertise in female-oriented magazines, but that's obvious and still a bit limiting. How about putting out small amounts of Space Channel 5 branded collectibles and knick-knacks in those weird "whatever the hell sells" shops that litter every mall? Just little things that look nifty and cost a buck. How about sponsoring retro-styled club nights in some of the bigger cities around the US? Put some free singles of the theme song at the counter at places like Tower or Virgin Megastore. Things like that would have been a lot more effective than $50,000 commercials in between Creed videos.

[Lance]

.
i would have thought it far more effective than their actual campaign to have A: showed commercials that were entirely game footage with a brief spokesman voiceover on general programs instead of small target markets, and B: to have made free demo CDs available in stores that sold the Dreamcast machine.

technique A should have succeeded simply because Dreamcast graphics were clearly and stunningly superior to anything that had existed before, put all that graphic excitement in front of a wider audience, and it should generate sales. it was too often the hardcore that sat on their asses waiting for a ps2 because of the numbers Sony was publishing on gamesites and in game magazines. Sega should have counteracted that by showing the reality of superior graphics right now, in action, on the televisions that would be used to play the games. not enough people got to actually see them. you couldn't tell just how fantastic they were by seeing a little still pic online and some megaflop numbers in a magazine.

technique B?
i've been rather easily convinced to buy things by picking up and testing demos of things on CD in such places as Mars, the Musicians's Planet stores. it's an effective merchandising technique that was being widely used by other companies of various sorts at the time the Dreamcast was introduced to America. it might have been good if Sega had done it, too
.

[Vasudeva]

We shouldn't forget here that the PS2 had *terrible* commercials no one understood but despite of that (and it being overpriced... Sony pulling a 'Saturn'!) became a success.

V.

[faB]

Hey sorry for reviving an old thread, I'm kinda new to the forums.

But I wanted to add something: I dont think I saw any mention of the Designers of the game. The graphic designers: DESIGNERS REPUBLIC. I dont know why they ended their partnership with the WipeOut series, but you can tell they left. WipeOut wouldnt be what it is without them. That's simply why WipeOut Fusion doesnt even begin to compare.

[Shem]

Pesonally I Like the design that was made by Good Tech. What I DON'T like about fusion is craft designs. Trerrible I say. Completly not in W"O style. The music also sux, it already sucked in W3O, but that's my opinion. The design for, W3O just didn't feel right to me becouse of it's minimalistic feeling. Personally I lked the jucyness of WXL design, not to metion the the japanese influence that could be felt in the first W'O design.
I think that Good Tech was close, but not close enough.

[science]

hmm, thats wierd that you dont like the music in 3 or fusion... it all sticks to the same genre, although i do definitely think that XL has the best soundtrack.

[Shem]

I Have to explain something Science.
Music in first W'O was really great, although there weren't many tunes acctually bought from artists like Chemical Brothers, or Leftfield.
It was kinda techno-breakbeat style. In XL most of the tracks were licensed, and it kicked ass! I consider this selection of tunes as the best one in history of Wipeout. W3O and DJ Sasha.....too much trancy, wussy, wierd, wannabe-futuristic. Only few tracks had paid my attention - Proppelerheads, Chem. Bros. In my opinion it should be something hard, like Loops Of Fury, The Third Sequence, Chemical Beats. It would give a rush. And this is my point - music should intensify the gameplay (I still remember that fall-down track part on Altima along with Chemical Beats bursting my ears out).

[science]

The only song in the WO series that i ever considered to be remotely "hard" was FSOL's "We have explosive", and that's just because they used a sort of acid-type sound.

[eno]

All I can say is I am a HUGE Wipeout fan. It was my first PS game and I still love everything about it.

I like all the Wipeouts from Wipeout,WIpeoutXL,Wipeout64,Wipeout3 but on Wipeout Fusion, they raped the game of its controls. It felt like they dumbed it down for the tards that like the Fzero style games. In the previous games using the up and down nose pitch would be a huge part of the control you had on the ship but in Fusion even if you tried to raise the nose of the craft to hover longer or drop faster , it wouldn't matter , there was like set gravity. Which in some ways it might seem like a small issue but in another hand , its the controls that set this game apart, having to master the controls to get precise timings on each course unlike Fzero that you can bounce off all the ways and still maintain a high sense of speed. Fusion is for the birds IMO, I can't stand how they robbed the controls. I just bought the Old XL PC version and I got that excitment back now, I just have to get a controller to work with it and I am set. Had to underclock my Video Card from 340/740 to 75/100 :). My second machine I dropped it from a 3.6ghz to a 1.5ghz with a underclocked 9700pro and still was way too fast.


Long live the original Wipeouts when the controls were still dialed in.

[Sausehuhn]

I think no WipEout-game is really bad!
Yes, some are better and some not of course. But I think, every WipEout-fan should have his own opinion and maybe his own favorite, too. So if someone says, WipEout Fusion is bad, he has a reason for saying and if someone says, Wip3out is bad, he has a reason for thinking too.... Nothing is perfect!

And: there will be a new WipEout - and maybe it will be better than all the others!

Sausehuhn

[Shem]

God I HOPE SO!!
(Bring my AG SYSTEMS back!!!!! :evil: )